The Battle over Fulton Sheen's Beatification

A saint’s cause gets cleared for the finish line, then suddenly stalls for years. What happened, who pushed back, and why did it revolve around something as physical as Fulton Sheen’s remains? We walk through the full timeline with Dr. Peter Howard, who has spent decades studying Sheen’s life, writings, and prophetic edge, and who helped rally a grassroots movement to push for clarity and progress.

We talk about the New York vs Peoria clash, the court case led by Sheen’s niece, and the quiet urgency of moving a body once the courts ruled. Then we get into the official “caution” explanation that kept coming up: the looming New York attorney general report on clergy abuse handling. Howard shares why he believes Rome never had a theological or canonical problem with Sheen’s cause, and how institutional fear and American church politics combined into an indefinite postponement that left the faithful confused and frustrated.

From there the conversation opens up into the bigger questions people bring to Sheen: his “anti-church” warning, his apocalyptic language as an “unveiling,” and the sense that our era is accelerating into spiritual conflict. We connect Sheen’s insights to Marian themes, Our Lady of Guadalupe, Lourdes, and Fatima, and we wrestle with modern pressures like propaganda, ideological capture, gender ideology, and the rush toward AI and transhumanism. It’s a Catholic Church conversation that stays anchored in history, theology, and the practical need for hope.

We also share details for the Fulton Sheen beatification conference and pilgrimage, built to help Catholics understand why Sheen matters now and how “America’s saint” could shape a uniquely Catholic culture in the United States. If this helped you, subscribe, share it with a friend who loves Fulton Sheen, and leave a review. What part of the Sheen story still feels unanswered to you?

Transcript

Cold Open And Guest Setup

SPEAKER_03 0:32

Wow, I was caught off guard without a funny intro video. So typically we open with like a funny intro video, but when we have guests on, we it's very dependent upon who the guest is. But um Dr. Peter Howard, um we uh we were introduced by a mutual friend, and um we wanted to get you on because you guys are getting ready for uh a conference out by out I I think for for the canonization of oh not for canonization, it'd be out of the jumping jump in the gun there.

SPEAKER_01 1:02

Yeah, my wish it should be it should be the canonization by this point.

SPEAKER_03 1:06

Well, that I kind of want to get into that a little bit and in what some of the drama has been around that. But before we even get into that, what you want to give everybody just like a little synopsis of what you what you guys do over at because I could I I hadn't heard of you before we were introduced, but I've been checking out your videos for the past couple of days, and there's a lot of stuff I think we're gonna get into that we'll agree on, especially some of your apocalyptic views I thought were very interesting, and I'm I'm curious to get into the uh Archbishop Fulton Sheen anti-church prophecy with you. Uh so I think we'll we'll have a really good conversation, but you want to give people a little synopsis

How Fulton Sheen Changed His Life

SPEAKER_03 1:40

of what you do?

SPEAKER_00 1:41

Sure.

SPEAKER_01 1:42

Well, um I say for almost 30 years now, Sheen Fulton Sheen's been kind of uh the universe that God's put me in spiritually, historically, and prophetically, and uh he took completely changed my life. So um, you know, during that time I was I was blessed to study in Rome, and then I um was able to do my doctorate on Sheen in Rome. And uh and and every chance I've had ever since then, ever since I he kind of took a grip of me back in the late 90s. Um after a personal retreat I went on, I just dedicated everything I could uh to Fulton Sheen. While I'm serving in the church in different capacities, I've served under a bishop and a tribunal. I've you know, uh I I've I've do a lot of speaking, so um conferences, that kind of stuff. It's it's wherever uh the Lord will allow me to go and and and kind of hit them hard. You know, a lot of what I do is uh it's a combination of theology, history, spirituality, waking people up. Um, and then of course a massive call to action, and very concretely, you know, a couple of things that I emphasize. So this has morphed over the years into starting a Fulton Sheen Institute right before COVID hit, and that took a blast to it, like it did for most people. Um, but it was just uh like a month or so before his beatification was supposed to happen in 2019. Um, and I I was looking at that as a launch pad. So um Gord had a delay button on that in some respects, but has used that time now since that. We we started a movement uh two in uh 2023, uh largely in response to the the cause of Sheen. This beatification was indefinitely postponed, and most people didn't understand why. Uh, and still many people don't really know um what had happened. Um, and all up until the point where just last September I was in Rome for the the double canonization of Carlo Acudis and Pierre Giorgio Fersati. Took my son Beckett to be there. And in that time, I took a petition that we started when the movement started in 2023. It uh revolved around a petition, which was giving a voice to people all around the world to express their desire to have Fulton Sheen beatified, um, and for and the re and laying out the reasons why. Um, and so it became uh a little bit of a you know uh a battle, you can say. I I think I saw one of your uh titles for this show ahead of time. I think it's something like The Battle for Sheen, and I was like, oh gosh, I don't know where he's gonna go with this one.

SPEAKER_03 4:23

Um we were actually we were actually trying to figure out what title we were going to go with. It's like I because I do want to discuss some of the back and forth between Dolan and Peoria. I definitely want because I don't know if I fully understand what was going on there. I know it had to do with his remains being at St. Patrick's Cathedral, but I don't know the full story there. Before even that, though, are you are you a cradle or a convert?

SPEAKER_00 4:47

I'm a cradle.

SPEAKER_03 4:48

Good boy. We like cradles, cradles, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:51

Don't rock it, don't rock the cradle, man.

SPEAKER_03 4:54

It's convert infiltration. We're trying to put an end to it. So okay. Um, so all right, so co so you start this uh a month before COVID hits, and then COVID just puts a halt on everything because the whole world stops during COVID. Yeah, and

The Beatification Delay Explained

SPEAKER_03 5:10

then they delay the can uh the beatification process also during that time, and the this this fight breaks out between New York and Peoria, right?

SPEAKER_01 5:20

Well, the fight between uh New York and Peoria precipitated the the canceling of the beatification back in December of 2019. Like this is why it was such an issue, and especially to me, I mean that it wasn't just because sheen was my world, it was because I knew she was given to the church and the world for this moment. And to see really as I saw it, um, I saw the you know the devil getting involved in this. And when you look at the facts of things, there was never a reason to ever have a legitimate reason to have paused it. So all of that was 2019. The first thing was the battle over the body of Sheen. This was um, see if I can summarize this predecessor of Dolan, uh Cardinal Egan, he was uh friendly with Bishop Genki of the Diocese of Peoria. And the Diocese of Peoria, they were the diocese who took on the cause for canonization. New York easily could have done it, and they would have had the resources. It would have been not a very, you know, as far as that standpoint goes, it would have been a good place to do it. But they didn't. And so Peoria is like, well, he's he was a priest ordained for the diocese of Peoria. Uh, we're gonna do it. We need we need him as a saint. So anyway, um when Cardinal Eagle left, Cardinal Dolan came in, the the music changed. And Bishop Jenke was basically like, okay, well, since we're doing the cause, Cardinal Egan said that would be a good uh opportunity to then transfer the body from New York to Peoria. And you know, it's like okay, New York, New York, you had your chance. And but then Cardinal Donald says, Well, that was Cardinal Egan, now there's a new Cardinal in town, and I don't that I'm not bound to that, and he and Sheen's not going anywhere, so you can imagine behind the scenes this rift that's going on. Eventually, Fulton Sheen's um only surviving niece, Joan Cunningham, um she got involved and as next of kin could actually fight for her uncle's body. And so she uh launched a court case to have him released. Sheen never said he wanted to be buried in in um the uh cathedral anyway. Um and so she for a number of years she was fighting this, and she won on the uh the first level, local level, then New York appealed it. The appellate court upheld Joan Cunningham, and then it went to the state supreme court of New York, and then they upheld it as well. So it was like literally strike three for Cardinal Dolan. And at that point, the uh Supreme Court of New York ordered the doc the Archdiocese of New York to immediately transfer the body. So this happened very, very fast once that happened, and it was like in the dead of night, no ceremony. It was like, how do we basically extract Sheen and move him out toward Peoria, like so that nobody even knows about it? Um, the only person that really was there to capture that, the only footage on that was uh Christine Niles. Maybe she may know of Christine.

SPEAKER_02 8:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:43

So anyway, uh she's been a huge supporter of this entire cause and movement as well to get the truth out and um to you know to get the uh Sheen moving forward. Um, so anyway, um at that point, uh, this was this was like mid-2019, right after the body was moved, um Pope Francis issued the decree that gave the formal approval of the miracle that was needed for him to be edified to be beatified. So now you've got you know two positive check marks here, and at that point, once you had the decree, it's it's literally set the date, and so they set a date um for December. Actually, it was supposed to be earlier, they were moving so fast. This was like July, was the decree, and they wanted to have like a September-ish um beatification, and then Bishop Matano of Rochester began to step in a little bit more, and the there was some more kind of obstructions that were being put in there saying, Well, maybe we should look at this, and the diocese of Pure is like, why didn't you mention this earlier? And by the way, we already knew about that, so like that's irrelevant, but that kept putting things in. He um he got to the Why do you think that is?

SPEAKER_03 9:58

Like, why do you why do you think there has been such resistance to this?

SPEAKER_01 10:04

Well, there's different reasons, like different perspectives you can look at it. The one that would like you could almost say what was the motive of Bishop Matano, what was the motive of Cardinal Dolan, and then the other cardinal that was involved was Cardinal Supic in the end, um, who worked with Matano to basically tell Rome they're not at all comfortable with this, and they they gave another excuse. Uh well they also said, yeah, I mean the other part was the ultimate the excuse that they gave was um there was an attorney general report that had been gathering its testimonies and investigations, things for years, like they've done in in other states, Pennsylvania, Ohio, a lot of states have gone through this, especially out on the East Coast, um, in regards to the clergy sex abuse scandal. Uh how did bishops deal with this? So it's to look at the whole history, you know, like 50, 60 years probably, of all the dioceses within each state. Well, New York, they had theirs underway through the attorney general. And um, and then then uh eventually, I don't know if she was in it from the beginning, but then you know Letizia James is there. So um, and they said, Well, we don't have this report yet, so we're really uncomfortable having a celebration, which is what how they saw the beatification of Fulton Sheen with potential shadows that could be now. We're not expecting any shadows, but we just want to be very cautious about this. Okay, on one level, everybody could be like, Well, this is great. Uh like, I mean, not great, but okay, well, I might not like it, but that kind of makes sense. Well, the real story is there wasn't anything that could have been brought up that Rome with the Diocese of Peoria had not already looked at to get to the point where they can literally shut the case on Sheen. And so a lot of it you can say was somewhat playing on the ignorance of others, but there was a lot of power. Bishop Matano, because the reason why is Fulton Sheen was the Bishop of Rochester for three years after the Second Vatican Council. It was kind of where he was put in exile afterward from Cardinal Spellman. And um, and so it was it was that time.

SPEAKER_03 12:29

I don't mean to jump in. What was the beef between Spellman and like what is that? We'll get into that.

SPEAKER_01 12:36

Well, okay. I'll summarize that. Cardinal Spellman was the most powerful prelate like in the church outside of the Holy Father during his time, even among the Europeans. He was that like it was joked that he was so powerful, he was the only one who had a line to the Pope. And and his biography kind of says it all. It says America's Pope, Cardinal Spellman. Um, so he was the one who really raised and groomed Sheen for all the positions and opportunities that he had. So um, whether it be uh eventually he became archbisho uh auxiliary bishop of the of New York, but his television window uh was opened up because of Cardinal Spellman. Um, I mean, everything like he was he was I'm not a kingmaker, but you know what I mean. Like he was sheen was so modern Tupage.

SPEAKER_03 13:31

Kind of the old Tupage is now the kingmaker.

SPEAKER_01 13:34

He kind of, yeah. And and he's the most feared, yeah. It's both, it's both in. Like you don't cross this person, so nobody ever crossed Cardinal Spellman. He was close to every Pope during his time. Well, there were two riffs that came up. Well, as soon as Sheen was made the national director for the propagation of the faith, which is now the Pontifical Mission Society, which he did for um a number, gosh, I mean for a number of years, almost 20 years or so. Um he Cardinal Spellman, who was his predecessor, kind of kept his his hands on things, or at least thought he could. And one of the things was, you know, he liked to travel around and he would bring gifts to everyone. He was like, oh, the most magnanimous person, but he was using money from the Society for the Propagation of the Faith. Well, one time he asked for some money to do this, and Sheen said no. And so it was Sheen was the first person who really told Cardinal Spellman no. He's like, No, this money's for the poor and it's not going anywhere. Well, that rift started trickling to Rome. Um, and then the but the one that broke the back of the of on the issue was Cardinal

The Court Fight Over Sheen’s Body

SPEAKER_01 14:50

Spellman uh basically inherited or had donated to him what ended up being like millions of dollars worth of powdered milk. And he then gave them to the Society of the Propagation of the Faith, but then said, Well, I want to be reimbursed for them. And Sheen's like, uh that's not gonna happen. One, you've given it to us, two, I know you didn't pay for them. They were gifts, you know. So that rift went to the Pope as well. But this time they had um Sheen had the receipts in his hand.

SPEAKER_03 15:25

And when Paul VI or John Paul II?

SPEAKER_01 15:28

No, this is actually um this is Pius XII.

SPEAKER_03 15:33

Oh, this is all this is before the council this stuff is going on.

SPEAKER_01 15:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:37

Oh wow, okay.

SPEAKER_01 15:38

I mean, it's that's all yeah, right around that time. So um, so this was a big deal because Cardinal Spellman was asserting that these were his, and then Sheen does, he pulls out the receipts. So literally in front of the Pope, Cardinal Spellman's proven to be a liar, and so he immediately like the the relationship between him and the Pope was gonna was ruptured, no trust, and like this. It's like a movie, you could like the music changes, it goes really dark, and then there's like the you know, the death look to the like Spellman the Sheen. And he and he basically tells him afterwards, like, I'm gonna spend the rest of my time destroying you. And that's why the plug got pulled on this TV show immediately. Um, and then uh then the council came, and then after the council, Sheen didn't return to New York, New York. He he then was sent up to Rochester. Sort of sent up to Rochester.

SPEAKER_04 16:33

Is there anything to the uh the rumors that Spellman was maybe one of the four communist cardinals that Bella Dodd named to uh Fulton Sheen?

SPEAKER_01 16:43

I really don't know. I really don't know. What uh what I would suspect he wasn't, but just from what I've I've learned about him, um I think he was a pretty conservative, if you want to use that word. I don't like to, you know, that's how you use that, it doesn't mean that much anymore.

SPEAKER_03 17:04

You could go back and you find stuff Spellman said, and he sounded very conservative, but it's kind of like it's kind of kind of weird because like even under Benedict, uh, we had a lot of the guys who we thought were like super conservative, and then once Francis came in, it's like the those guys, the the mask kind of came out and we found we found that out.

SPEAKER_01 17:23

I don't know, I really don't know. Um, but anyway, that's the story behind that whole thing with Spellman and Sheen. So it's what's interesting though is that because from that time onward, and Sheen never talked about this publicly. He would, I mean, this is uh actually one of the things that makes them, I think, a great saint because he had all the truth on his side. Um, he's such a public figure that you know he he could have like today, people just bring it to the airwaves of the podcast, and it's just this all-out fight. I would venture to say very strongly that I think she would disagree with a lot of of how things are being handled today, um, in the midst of like, yeah, you're we're fighting for truth, but there's a time where it comes in where it becomes also odd hominum and to the point where even offices themselves are attacked. So, you know, I I could agree probably with 90 to 95% of what people would say of why they're upset or why something, but you listen or you watch further, it it becomes about them at a certain point, and then they their ego steps in and the devil gets in. And in the name of orthodoxy, they're actually causing sometimes more damage than even some of the liberal nonsense and crud that we have to deal with. So the devil finds a way in either way. She was smart, he just withdrew, and then he, as he said, he didn't retire, he retreaded and he focused on priests and giving retreats. And thank God he did because it was a retreat that he gave in 1972 that was given to me when I was discerning my place in life that changed the entire course of my life.

SPEAKER_03 19:02

How old are you? What do you mean?

SPEAKER_01 19:04

I'm 74.

SPEAKER_03 19:06

Stop being nonsense. How old are you? What did you what did you see a recording of the city?

SPEAKER_01 19:13

I'm 52, so I'm born in 74.

SPEAKER_03 19:15

Oh, I was gonna all right. I'm like, wait, you were at something discerning in 72? Go on.

SPEAKER_01 19:20

No, okay. Well, yeah, I listened to a retreat that was on cassette tapes. So you and we we you and I, we we know what that stuff is. Um, but it was a remastered set, and so it sounded so clear. It wasn't like you know, oh my gosh, you could tell this is from the 1940s, or like it was almost as clear as you're hearing me right now.

SPEAKER_03 19:39

There's some great ones on YouTube. There's there's like uh, I mean, I my exposure to Fulton Sheen has been from listening to his sermons on YouTube or like rebroadcasts of his TV show from back in the day. Like, that's that's my initial exposure to Fulton Sheen. And is he still just as much of an evangelist now after his death as he was while he was alive? Like, I know countless people who came into the faith because they heard a Fulton Sheen sermon or they read his book, The Life of Christ, or something like that, you know?

SPEAKER_01 20:13

Yeah, well, I mean wisdom and holiness is is timeless. And that's also where another thing that kind of I think characterizes some um somebody who's full of the Holy Spirit more than others, um at least what what in when they produce certain things, like for Sheen, I've never heard something that hasn't has a thunderous effect on me, um, unlike others. And it's not saying like others like aren't holy or whatever, but you know what I mean? Um when I listened to him on on that retreat, I had not I never even knew of him, other than like a reference with no actual citation of anything. It's like, oh yeah, Fulton Sheen was the and that was like it a few times, and that that was right after this is right after uh my undergraduate at Franciscan University in in Stubenville. So I had great professors, I mean outstanding professors. I never heard of Sheen. And so when I put him on, I actually thought he was English or Irish, and the way he talked, it had like an Irish tinge to his his voice, even though he's from Illinois. Um, but anyway, that yeah, he like he gripped me. It's like that when people would heard Jesus, you know, who's this man who speaks with such authority? And like, where's he from? And it's kind of funny because like Sheen, you know, he's from El Paso, Illinois. Everybody's like, well, where's that? Like nobody knows where that is. It's outside of Peoria, it was a farm area. So anyway, um, yeah, just uh extraordinary uh power, and not to get in, but if you look over my shoulder here, kind of pointing at it right there. Oops, tell me this this was a sign that he was meant to be in my life later on. The guy who recorded that retreat in Dallas, Texas, it was the priests and seminarians. His name is Dan Stefan. Great man. Thank God he recorded this because that literally changed my entire life. Um, I our paths crossed when I was doing my doctoral work, and he gave me the original remastered CDs that he had from that retreat. And then he said, I want to give you something else that you alone would probably appreciate more than anyone. And he he gave he called it his Sheen Shrine. And in it was a glass globe in this big box, I and pictures of him and Fulton Sheen and a handwritten letter on uh as well, and was this microphone, and that was the microphone Fulton Sheen used

Abuse Report Fears And Rome’s Stance

SPEAKER_01 22:40

for the retreat that I listened to.

SPEAKER_03 22:41

Oh wow, isn't that pretty cool? And so that'll be what a second class or a third class.

SPEAKER_01 22:48

Yeah, I'm looking for a little piece of hair or something, but it's a first class.

SPEAKER_03 22:53

I'll claim it. So bring bring us up to date now. Like, where where are we at? We have a we have a date set for the beatification, like uh Pope Leo actually put a date on the calendar now, right?

SPEAKER_01 23:03

Yeah, well, they work it out with the um the diocese of Peoria, and it moved while it was it seemed like it was never moving, you know, for a while because that insistence of we have to get this um New York report, well, we're almost seven years later, and it's and actually it's still not out, it never came out. So I'd like to think that everyone who was involved in our movement had a a part to play in that. The fact that when I went to Rome last September, I um I I beautifully or actually my wife beautifully uh prepared the petition in a box and we brought it to the Dicastery of Saints because I I promised everybody said, Look, if I ever get to Rome, I'll deliver it. And that's what happened. And I also said if I get to Rome and I get close up to Pope Leo, I'll just shout out, please, you know, let's get him back on track, beatify him. God answered both of those prayers within 24 hours. Um, so I was able to go and drop off the petition and actually speak with the Dicastery of Saints about the whole thing, where it's at, where it's going. And they just confirmed the history that I knew. Rome never ever had a problem. There wasn't a reason to really stop it the first time, but because of the insistence of the prelates in America, they kind of said basically, Well, you guys worked this out.

SPEAKER_03 24:24

Well, the the thing is never got worked out because the because the church doesn't have the uh devil's advocate anymore, they were able to use that. And because it should have been something that the church was able to do their own due diligence on and they would have known, which they probably do, like you're saying, like they they have had all this time to research it themselves, but there is this report looming still, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 24:49

So I I but in the end, as we know today, like we we don't have that report hasn't been published, nobody really knows what's been in it so far, and that was the number one reason that was used. So it just verifies the fact of it was never a valid excuse, it was something that we had to simply deal with, and that's why, like I said, that's why we had a movement to at least I can talk about stuff, but people might expect me to say those kinds of things. But when you get people from around the world and you're gathering signatures, and then you go and they see what you're doing in Rome, and you and that you deliver it. I have an interview that I did um with the guy. He, I mean, the the undersecretary let me record, video record the whole thing. Um, he gave it to Carl Sameraro, who wasn't there that day, but he assured me, and I believe him, he was going to do it right after. Great conversation. And then the next day I saw Pope Leo at an audience. He was literally, you know, eight feet in front of me because his little Pope mobile stopped. There was a baby next to me, and you're like, oh my gosh, this is a great setup.

SPEAKER_03 25:53

Yeah, we're bringing babies to Rome with us when we know. I know we get the handover, and I'm gonna throw him a pack of knickknacks if I'm close enough.

SPEAKER_01 26:03

Exactly. So but it worked out. He they stopped, and I just I was like a kid, so I who knows what I said. It was probably embarrassing, but it was like, you know, holy father, please be out of sheen. Please be out of sheen. Well, I think at one point I said bless Fulton Sheen, but I kept saying it kind of like I think it was like Zacchaeus and the tree, you know, like trying to get everybody's attention. And eventually he stopped and he looked at me. And he this is all rather fast though, but I have it on camera, and it gave me a quick thumbs up, and then you just kept going. Yeah, for me, it was like prayers answered, like confirmation. And then within a few months of that, then it was leaked out from the the pillar. Um, and that uh that a beatification date was imminent, which means the Holy See basically told Peoria, pick a date now. Yeah. So there we are. And and so now seven years later, it's like I don't want to say it's a lot of it, it's good because we're at this point. I don't like to get back and try to relitigate a lot of that. I mean, sometimes it's good just so people can understand the history too, because you know, why like how could this have happened? And I pray that this never happens again, that that that that's even possible. Um, but you know, now we are, and I I I would argue, even though it's been uh uh a painful wait, uh not because of like oh our efforts weren't recognized, it's because sheen's all about the salvation of souls and the conversion of souls. That how many people could have been reached in six and a half years with blessed Sheen when he like you know, this this beatification will be shockwaves going around the world. Many people will rediscover him, who've heard of him, others will be like, Well, who is this guy? Because everybody's gonna be talking about him for at least a period of time.

SPEAKER_03 27:48

And yeah, it's like when Carlo Acudis was was uh canonized, it's like always uh everybody was just talking about Carlo Acudis for for how long.

SPEAKER_01 27:56

Yeah, and and and the times in which we live now, we need to take really good inventory of who the saints um that are that are being raised to the altar right now and why. Um, and and that's the big thing with Fulton Sheen. It's not just because he was kind of this TV celebrity, like, oh my gosh, I watched some things, I was moved by him. It's I to have another whole episode on this, but when you look at this, uh as Fulton Sheen says, God doesn't do anything in history without the greatest finesse of detail. I I quote this all the time, but it's one of my favorite quotes because you have to look at why is Fulton Sheen being beatified now, why is his feast day December 9th? Which like I could just say that one day is the acorn, as you unpack that, that explains all the significance

Spellman, Money, And The TV Fallout

SPEAKER_01 28:50

of why Sheen is one of the greatest saints to be brought at this end of this era, as he called it himself. He says, We're living in the days of the apocalypse, the last days of our era. Like, well, what does that mean? So, anyway, but that's he's not just using this symbolically, you know, he talks about the church having 500-year cycles. We're at the end of this fourth cycle of 500 years, and I would argue that that cycle began at the Reformation, yeah, 1531.

SPEAKER_03 29:21

Yeah. Yeah, he wanted to say he he also He was very apocalyptic, and most definitely in that one talk that I mean, that famous talk he gave, where he talks about the church and the anti-church. Uh does he call it an anti-church? Or is he he said he says the the body of the the mystical body of the devil will look like the the the body of Christ and the mystical body of Christ and the mystical body of antichrist.

SPEAKER_01 29:50

He called it the ape of the church, the ape of the church, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:54

Yeah, yeah, it's kind of interesting, man. Like because do you have a very apocalyptic view uh for the times that we're in right now?

SPEAKER_01 30:06

Absolutely. I mean, I I definitely agree with Sheen. Uh even um you know, my other passion is Mariology. So when I wrote on Sheen, it was basically the what was the the heart of his Mariology um and and marrying the modern world. Uh and and Sheen, this guy was his insights were not just brilliant, but they were so pro so prophetic that the more we learn about Sheen's connection with the history of the last 500 years and and where we're going, I would say within the next you know, seven years, um it will it will not only just blow your mind because it's really undeniable these kinds of connections, but it gives us a lot of hope because everything around us, we see we we see nothing, well we see very you know little other than shadows and things getting worse, wars, rumors of wars, um our country you know being marched into like just insanity, you know. Um people ask you, well, what would Sheen say or you think about what's going on now? Um, I I would just say he disagree with anything that's going on right now. Um but anyway, uh but apocalyptic view from a strict meaning of the word, you know, a Greek word that means unveiling. That's what's happening. That's even if you weren't a theologian, the the world is waking up. Yeah, the veil's being lifted on many, many different layers. On a spiritual level, it's not only being lifted, the veil is also getting a lot thinner. We can see very, it's almost you know tangible, the evil that's before us. Yeah, um, because it's also knowing its time is short and it's like a bear that's cornered, and it's not just gonna like crouch down and start whimpering. It's gonna eventually it just go all out. And that's kind of where we're at. So it's good to see you know people wake up, especially Catholics. I think Catholics are the slowest in my experience. The Catholics are the slowest to wake up to what's really going on in the world. Um, they've been very trusting of secular media and the just propaganda of, you know, if you if you question any narrative, you're a conspiracy theorist. And and then if you say, well, that was a conspiracy, just how we got to that word conspiracy theorist by the CIA uh after the JFK you know assassination to cover up any uh opposing arguments, you know. So it's like we're we we're in such an information war that it's uh it's it's changed, it's it's challenged. But Sheen said himself, he says, only those who really have faith really know what's going on in the world. He said most people really don't know what's going on, yeah. Um, and so that I so it's apocalyptic in that sense that we experiencing this, and I said at the same time, we are we are at an end of an era, and uh we're clearly coming to the end of something, right?

SPEAKER_03 33:11

Like you can see the the the civilization around us is hanging on by a thread. You can see the the the world has its own plans on what they think they want to do. I personally think we'll see the antichrist in our lifetimes. I mean, depending on how old we are or how long we live, but um I Robnik is alive right now, yeah. I think he's very well could be on the world stage right now. Um, yeah, I I have this pressing feeling like we are racing towards the battle of Armageddon right now. Like that that's what the world feels like it is racing towards the battle of Armageddon right now.

SPEAKER_01 33:54

Well, I think I mean literally, I guess Armageddon will be at the end of time. Um, because that's where the final judgment will be. Um but we're think of it this way, if you think of Fatima, there's going to be a tr a real triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, and there's going to be an era of peace. These aren't just casual words. That word era is very, very important. And it was to Sheen as well. Um, and like I said, like if we started unpacking the significance of 1531.

SPEAKER_03 34:35

So do you so do you think that era will be a 500-year era?

SPEAKER_01 34:39

Oh, I don't know what I don't know what yeah, I don't know, uh, because I don't know when the end is.

SPEAKER_02 34:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:47

Um, but uh when you look back at history, as Sheen was doing, he was describing how there was always a big crisis that needed to be dealt with um in the world and how is it how it affected the church. And so the you know, the fall of the Roman Empire, the first turn, and we had Gregory the Great, and then we also had 500 years later, we have the Great Schism in the church, um, and the preparation at the same time for the medieval era, which became halfway through the high point, or near the end of it, I should say, um, in the 13th century, 16th century. Now we have an all-out assault within the churches on the faith itself.

SPEAKER_03 35:33

And you have second Christendom popping up in South America during that whole period.

SPEAKER_01 35:38

Yeah, I mean, it's it's yeah, you can look at it as as the disintegration of Christendom.

SPEAKER_03 35:43

Um in Europe, but in South America, there's like second Christendom popping up because Our Lady appears in Guadalupe down there.

SPEAKER_01 35:50

It's it's yeah, well, it's interesting. Yeah, that that that's a great point that nobody really talks about. The foundations of what is to come are there. But what's interesting is like it started there, um, and how this the faith sprint down because of um the Spanish, you know, Portuguese settlements down there. But that's south of obviously Mexico City, because you know, Mexico City is modern-day Mexico City, where she appeared, is the geographic center of all the Americas. So the North has is not claimed for Christ explicitly or even for the Catholic Church as the South was. But what's interesting is that all the kernels, the foundations of what is going to happen, because there's no doubt in my mind, and I don't,

The Anti-Church Prophecy And Apocalypse

SPEAKER_01 36:40

and this isn't like just I don't mere speculation, it's a theological conclusion, but it's also based on history and seeing what's happening. The future of all the Americas, but especially North America, is Catholic. It there's our country, as we celebrate our 250th anniversary, as we know it, it's over. I I say that you know, I I don't mix my words on that. We've tried everything.

SPEAKER_03 37:07

I gotta cut it because Rob's over here saying that Mexico City is not South America. It's all Mexico, it doesn't matter. Everything is Mexico, so yes, it's Central America. Everything's Central America. I'll go with that.

SPEAKER_01 37:20

Everything's South of Mexico is Mexico. Okay, yeah, you can get your ruler out, I guess. But if you look at it, oh no, I'm making fun of it, Anthony.

SPEAKER_03 37:27

Yeah, he's making fun of me because he's going in South America. Oh, he's in South America. He gets mad at me when I say this.

SPEAKER_01 37:35

Right, he's from New York, you know.

SPEAKER_03 37:37

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:40

Sorry, I read the broadcast with an odd system. No, but it's it is an interesting point, though, in that because it it did make me think of how it's well, first off, our wesent mother claimed the bottom half of the Americas, and and it was Catholic explicitly in its culture and all that, in the indigenous groups and and and Mesoamerica at large. But then when you look you know to the north, of course, you have um now the United States, a very young country, of course, Canada. And the roots of the land that we had that preceded our country's founding was Catholic. You know, when you look at the the names of the Mississippi River, it was called the River of the Immaculate Conception. So that's another thread that everyone really needs to learn here because the age of Our Lady of Guadalupe is the age of the Immaculate Conceptions, the era of the Immaculate Conception. I love talking about this, but I just know I could do this in here. But that's why the the date that she appeared, December 9th. Yeah, yeah. I mean, that that goes all the way back to the 5th century. That was the original feast day. Um and you also have the um the Aztec, although they didn't this didn't become her name, there's some things that aren't exactly accurate when people say that uh she called herself Quatra Supe, which is the Aztec word. Um but what's interesting, she like she really did reveal her name as Guadalupe. But what's interesting is that the Aztecs couldn't naturally pronounce Guadalupe. So if they were to say who she was, they would say Quatra Supe. It's about the closest thing. And the meaning of Quatrasupe is the woman who crushes the serpent. So Genesis 3.15, first scripture of the feast of the Immaculate Conception after in 1854 and afterward. But as she says, the modern era really began in um in 1858, when you had Charles Darwin writing Origin of Species, you had John Stuart Miller having an essay on um economics and as freedom from the law, um, and you had Karl Marx, who wrote an essay on political philosophy, I think it was called, I forget the exact title, but says um religion is anti-human. So you have the big assaults that would um form the the great the three great philosophies that would be at war with Western civilization, Christian Western civilization up until the modern time. And the reason why Sheen said this was so important also is because as Darwin is asserting, and now that we've seen everybody picking this up, you know, I I caught I was with actually I was listening to your previous episode not too long ago, talking about the earth and Darwin and all that stuff.

SPEAKER_02 40:40

Um I was John Burgs and his son on with us, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:46

So um anyway, basically, Carl uh uh um or uh what's his name? Darwin with his origin of species is saying man's an animal. And if man's an animal, then man is without sin. And if man was is without sin, then as she put it, we're all immaculately conceived. Heaven's response wasn't to send a bunch of theologians and philosophers to come down and answer that. He sent his mother the same year to into Lourdes France, and what does she say at the very end? I am the Immaculate Conception. A loaded phrase as Saint Maximilian spent his you know his last years obsessed with that. So, like, what does that mean? Um, so that really like that's why we see this Marian era after the French Revolution, which everyone should understand as well, which was the way that all the philosophical framework for then Marx, Origin, uh Darwin, and John Stuart Mill and others to have this anti-human campaign to remove the image of God in every way from man. And today we've come to the end of the ideology and the philosophy of communism, which is not just reducing or removing economic inequality, it's re it's re-removing what it would consider all contradictions that would go after um uh husband and wife in a home, the what the family then means, all the way down to the gender difference itself. All of these things have to be kind of reconciled, synthesized into something that is generic. We're at that with the whole gender ideology war, the trans, and now it's transhumanism. You know, you talked about this battle of what's going to be coming. Well, yeah, it's the great reset of the World Economic Forum. You know, it's been lots of names, New World Order, and then you have the Kingdom of Christ. So that's what the Kingdom of Antichrist is. It's a complete counterfeit of all the things that the kingdom of Christ is. And like and if you look at AI and where we're going scientifically, there we're not going to be around the three years unless there's probably some major intervention. That's how fast things are moving right now.

SPEAKER_02 42:56

Yeah, I I feel the same way.

SPEAKER_03 43:00

Yeah, it's like uh things speed up towards the end of the cycle, like things start happening more with more rapidity towards the end. It's like uh unless these days were shortened, you know.

SPEAKER_01 43:13

Yeah, yeah, even the elect be deceived. That should sober us. A lot of people like, hey man, I'm there's no way. Like I know I'm so grounded in the truth and this and that in the orthodoxy, which is okay, that's great. But what the fact that that was said, that should humble us all. Like, well, you know, those that you think might make it or would be strong aren't strong. Yeah, and I don't know, sheen says, Well, be well, we're in for a lot of surprises, and said the biggest surprise would be if we find ourselves in heaven. So, anyway.

SPEAKER_03 43:48

Um, so what are you guys planning with the conference now? You you have a conference that you guys are doing now. Is it in is it like this uh in alignment with the beatification? Like, what do you what are you guys doing out there? And where is it? Give people info. How can they find out about it?

SPEAKER_01 44:02

Yeah, thank, yeah, thanks for letting me talk about it. Um, it's uh it's a beatification conference that our the Fulton Sheen movement is putting on. It's not associated with any of the activities of the official Archbishop Fulton Sheen Foundation, who worked with the Diocese of Peoria and works with the Diocese of Peoria for the canonical cause of Sheen. Like, you know, they were all involved to get all the work done to you know to get Sheen so that he's now ready to be uh beatified. But there's interesting is that as soon as we heard about the the announcement, like, okay, we need to have, we have to have a conference. Like, how are we gonna do it? How are we gonna afford it? Honestly, we don't know. We're we're extremely grassroots. We're not we're not coming from you know donations from anything large. People have been uh good just stepping up now. But uh this is a conference that we're doing because and and it's the eve before the beatification. The beatification is on Thursday, September 24th. Our conference is the day before Wednesday, September 23rd, and it's all day. We have Bishop Joseph Coffey, who's gonna be with us from the military archdiocese. Uh, he'll be with us. We have a pilgrimage that's actually happening that begins even earlier from the 19th of September in Peoria. On the 20th, we celebrate Sheen's anniversary to his priesthood. That's when he was ordained in 1919. And then we have a couple of days in Illinois or Peoria and seeing Sheen, his museum, venerating him. We also have a a Byzantine dimension to what we do because many people don't realize Fulton Sheen was Byzantine. He was the first.

SPEAKER_03 45:42

Oh no, he was a Biz LARPE. I don't know if I can finish this. Oh my god, no, no. We got a couple Byzantines in the chat right now. They're gonna be thrilled to hear that.

SPEAKER_01 45:52

Yeah, well, he was the first, he was the first to uh to celebrate the divine liturgy in English. Wow, and over a hundred thousand people were in attendance.

SPEAKER_03 46:02

Where did he do that?

SPEAKER_01 46:04

Uh in Pennsylvania, and I'm trying to think of the it's not Doyle's town, it's another

Guadalupe, Fatima, And History Cycles

SPEAKER_01 46:10

place, anyway. It's Pennsylvania.

SPEAKER_02 46:12

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 46:13

So um, and he he the reason he was by rituals because yeah, he was he was the number one enemy of the communists. He knew communism better than the communists, and he knew the threat of it. Um, as I was talking about, just like those those three philosophies all circulating in the 19th century. He knew where it was leading and he warned America. This is another where way he was really prophetic to where we are today. And he was he wanted to draw close to the to the um to the Christians who were suffering under communism. So a way that he did that was he he became biritual, so he would celebrate the divine liturgy and connect his episcopacy with them because he always he we talk about how the uh a bishop isn't just consecrated for his diocese, he's consecrated for the world. So I love that about Sheegan. He's a really he's a truly Catholic saint, he's he's east and west, he's both lungs, and I think he's a huge he'd be a huge bridge for the whole Orthodox, you know, uh thing that we need to fix up. I mean, there's actually nothing to be fixed, it's all historical, and at least that's the way I've always understood it when I was studying it many years ago. You know, that it's anyway.

SPEAKER_03 47:26

So, okay, so the conference is in Peoria.

SPEAKER_01 47:29

It's in St. Louis. So yeah, sorry, we get all these little parentheses. Um so we start in Peoria or on the pilgrimage. The conference is the last part of that, it's separate. You don't have to be on the pilgrimage to do this, but it's it's all day at St. Louis, just outside of where the beatification is. Um, it's the beatification is at the the dome in America Center in St. Louis, which I thought that was interesting. Um, and then uh our conference is uh just outside at the um Hilton St. Louis Frontenac. And um it is a is a conference where the real theme of the theme is is he's America's saint. So that's that's the big part of it.

SPEAKER_03 48:14

Is he we were we were talking, we did a show uh our last episode we were talking about how like uh how how can we form like a uniquely Catholic culture? Like because you see remnants of European culture, European Catholic culture everywhere, you know. You see uh if you have like a large Italian population, you'll see they still do processions like they did in Italy, Spanish, the same thing. But we don't have like a uniquely American tradition, like Catholic tradition yet. And I think I think we mentioned Fulton Sheen as like maybe like the basis of starting something like that, like our first like real American scene. I mean, I know we have a couple of others, but he would be like truly the first real well-known American saint that I think we could develop some traditions around to maybe start something cultural.

SPEAKER_01 49:03

Well, check this out. I was just looking for it. So if you're wondering what I'm I'm not watching is some other show, um, I pulled this up because it wasn't too long ago that I came across this that was also really solidified um the title we had chosen out before we I even really knew all of this. But he Sheen says this because he's he talks about America needs a modern saint. And he says, America needs a saint, an American saint. After 300 years of Catholic life, we cannot point to one saint who was born in this great land, who was educated in our schools, and showed in crisis how an American Catholic can relive the life of Christ crucified. We have the greatest Catholic school system in the world, the widest forms of charity work, the most compact army of teachers and religious, but the niches of our churches are empty. Our dollars are cleansing lepers, digging wells for Muslims, setting up chapels in Nigeria and orphanages in Japan. But we must be more than hewers of schools and drainers of dollars. We must give to the world more than our gifts. We ought also to present it with a saint, a saint to prove we are not as materialistic as some believe, a saint who would be a priest, and preferably a bishop, to prove that sanctity in a nation must begin with the bishops, then the clergy, and finally the faithful. He goes on, he says, um let's see.

SPEAKER_03 50:29

That alone, what an amazing irony he's describing himself, yeah, but he's also pointing out like how how like a a man who a bishop truly like truly formed in it and who truly loves Jesus Christ, like does see his role as bishop to be the saint, to lead the others to Christ like that. Like that's what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_01 50:56

The culture that we need has to be led by the church, and of course, connected to the apostles himself. I mean, I'll just go on a little bit because it's he actually then says who he's talking about, and you might take a little bit of pride in this um by the end. He says, uh, a saint who needs, let's see, who needs uh who must be born here but need not die here to prove that the melting pot of American bubbles bubbles over in its love of humanity and pays back the debt of immigration that made us great, a saint who might have been so American as to have gone to school in Brooklyn. For what city has such a ring of Americanism about it? A saint who would have served the church in other lands, for though he for though we want a saint from America, we do not want a saint who was only for America. We ought to present the world with a saint so American that his grandfather might have fought in the Civil War and his uncle might have lost his life when the Merrimack sank the Cumberland, whose father might have been the first newspaperman to publish a paper with a circulation of a million, whose grandfather on his mother's side might have driven one of the first trains into Des Moines, and whose parents might have been marked married by an American bishop. We need a saint so American that as a boy he would like all American boys, make fun of anyone with a foreign accent, and then prove that he meant it in such good faith that he would take the message of the gospel into foreign lands. In a word, we need a saint so American that he might have the same name as one of our automobiles. Saying that we want a saint like this is not to say we have one or will ever have one, but we believe we have a candidate to submit to the church for her decision in our great American missionary to China, Bishop Francis Ford. So that's who he was talking about in the end. But if you just took out that last part, you'd be like, oh my gosh, this is she.

SPEAKER_03 52:53

Yeah, but the fact is he wasn't speaking of himself, which you know what I mean. So it's like he he he he what he was but he's kind of right. Like I think, I think that we do need an American icon for us to look to. You know, like that's that's the whole purpose of icons, is that it's like we like we see a bit of Christ in that person, and we try to emulate that person because we see Christ in them. And yeah, Sheen definitely, definitely, definitely uh is a great is a great candidate that they're putting forward.

SPEAKER_01 53:28

Well, so I think the fact that it's this year, the 250th anniversary, how do you ignore that connection?

SPEAKER_03 53:35

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, also people say we can forgive them the immigration line. Immigration

Communism, Gender Ideology, And AI

SPEAKER_03 53:40

back during this speech was not immigration today, it's a lot different, right? Like he's the Italian and the Irish immigration.

SPEAKER_01 53:48

It's just disgusting. It's like you can't even say certain words.

SPEAKER_03 53:51

But that's where we are in our culture today. But you have to you have to put it in the context at the time that he's speaking about, and he's speaking about the European immigrants that came to our country and really did make this country what it is, other than uh Rob's ancestors, whatever he comes from. The Vikings, the Vikings, yeah. I don't know. He's Mongolian, I think. I don't know what he is from. Uh kid, okay. Um, okay, so how can people purchase uh tickets to go to the conference?

SPEAKER_01 54:20

How can they thanks for keep just bringing this back like a tether ball? You know, it can't get too far away, and you gotta get back. So let's just back up for just a second. Wednesday, September 23rd, all day at the uh Hilton Frontenac in St. Louis, uh is our Fulton Sheen, blessed Fulton Sheen, America Saint Conference. Um Fulton Sheen Conference.com is how you can learn. You can see all the speakers that we have. Um, and you can see uh an idea also of what the schedule is. Of course, we have a holy hour in it that was uh absolutely probably I think the foundation of why Sheen is a saint, where he got his heroic virtue from, because that's what a saint is defined as. Um, so we have a daily holy hour that Bishop Coffee will lead. And then we've got speakers all throughout the day. Speakers who are aren't just sitting there like rah-rah. Oh, like look, you know, here's a a story of Sheen. These are people whose lives have been like radically impacted by him. One of my favorites, he's actually he's a become a friend of mine. Everyone should get to know, is uh Jason Jones. I'm not sure if you're familiar with him.

SPEAKER_03 55:32

Yeah, we know who Jason Jones is.

SPEAKER_01 55:33

Yeah, hopefully you're you're nice to him.

SPEAKER_03 55:35

I I would like to get him on, actually. I think he's great. He doesn't mess around. Speaking about some very important topics right now that I would like to get him on for.

SPEAKER_01 55:43

So yeah, but he he's he is I call him he's the uh like Roosevelt, the a man in the arena. Um, I mean, he's there in Gaza, he's in Nigeria. Like when he talks about things, he's actually been there, he knows the people that are there. Um, and what Sheen, the heart of Sheen was to the vulnerable, and a lot of times people forget that because they just oh, they're just wowed by his intelligence. And so, but it this is something like he that's what kept him humble was his connection with the missions, the poor, the persecuted, the suffering. That's what really taught Sheen what it meant to really be a follower of Christ, and so Jason captures that, and he's also been in the Hollywood, yeah. Oh, he still is in the Hollywood scene movie production. Um, so anyway, he's just one of the speakers, you know, that we have. Um, so uh Arthur Brooks, people may know of him. Uh, he's a fascinating guy who brings who who talks about the themes of um that Sheen talks about quite a bit, like happiness, which people might think that's kind of generic. Like, no, that's what we're all seeking, so we better understand it. And Sheen says we're gonna have to start our evangelization of people from the human condition and then work the things divine. Arthur Brooks does it so masterfully in his realm of neuroscience that you see the complementarity that should be in the messages that we give, because it's all in the context of the incarnation of Christ and our humanity is is is the means to um to what we know, to what we love. Um, our you know, it's just very tabistic anyway. So he's one of our keynotes, Jason's another keynote. Um, and but check it out. We have a whole lineup of people there, but fultonsheenconference.com is where you can go and get the tickets. We actually have rooms at that hotel where the conference is taking taking place. We we have the whole like floor reserved. Um, it's gonna be fantastic. And uh if you want to stay there, we we can even help you get beatification tickets. We do have uh certain ones reserved for those who want to go all the way and stay with us. So fulton sheen conference.com is where you go. And I hope that people will make this this will never happen again, ever. I mean, yeah, there'll be she conferences like you have your Sikh conference like 2025 and Sikh Conference 2020, like the beatification conference for Sheen, just to prep to prepare for the beatification, which is I think more important so that when the when that proclamation comes the next day, you really get why he's America Saint, like what this really means, because the beatification is a launch point of of the next phase of a worldwide movement to bring Sheen into every single household. Because when that happens, as you we you've you've experienced, I've experienced it, everyone who's known Sheen experiences it. He uh whole

Beatification Conference Details And Tickets

SPEAKER_01 58:40

hearts and and and and families are changed, so that's why we're doing it, and we're the only one having a conference. Like that shocked us.

SPEAKER_02 58:48

Yeah, it is interesting.

SPEAKER_01 58:49

Isn't that interesting? So you I hope you're gonna be there. It's not too far of a drive.

SPEAKER_04 58:54

East Coast that we're gonna do.

SPEAKER_01 58:56

East Coast standards, like if you go to like Pennsylvania, you know, or or no, if you go to like Virginia or North Carolina, you feel like you need a passport. That's how that's how I grew up in New Jersey. It was like tri-state area, you know. Now I've just traveled most of the Western world.

SPEAKER_03 59:12

It's not bad. I used to go there all the time.

SPEAKER_01 59:13

So it's pretty cheap to go into St. Louis. So I hope we uh get some of your or a lot of your viewers to get so okay.

SPEAKER_03 59:20

So one more time, what's the website?

SPEAKER_01 59:22

Fulton Sheen Conference.com.

SPEAKER_03 59:25

Fultonsheen Conference.com. What's the date of the conference?

SPEAKER_01 59:28

Wednesday, September 23rd.

SPEAKER_03 59:31

Yeah, I mean, that's a good way to wrap up the summer. That's a pretty awesome thing to go do. If you guys are in the area, Fulton Sheen Conference.com. Um, Dr. Peter How is very nice getting you on, getting to know you. I think we should maybe after the conference get you back on to do like a history show or something. You seem to give a wealth of knowledge on history and comes together.

SPEAKER_01 59:52

All of our theology works has to work with history as it does with philosophy. And um, I mean, there are certain areas I you know I I'm pretty obsessed with because I think it's the main artery that if you were to draw a line of like how you really can make sense of everything that we're experiencing, that's what I focused on and and and so focus on. And I it it gives a I think it gives a lot of hope, even though we got, you know, as they said in Lord of the Rings, you know, the battle of Helb's deep is is over, but the battle for Middle-earth has just begun. That's kind of how I feel where we are right now. And Sheen comes in as a general Douglas MacArthur, and he's got like just like like MacArthur said to the Philippines when he left, he's like, I'll be back, you know, a very Schwarzenegger line. But he did, he meant it. He came back and he liberated them. MacArthur was Sheen's favorite American in history. So interesting how like everything converges in this he's a he was a small man, actually. He was like five, five or something like that, five, six. Anyway, he's a powerhouse, so we better get to know him because we don't have much time. And imagine somebody who's done all the heavy lifting for us to have to we don't have to figure everything out, like just put him together, and that's how I see what we do here with the movement and with the institute is to do that for people. But have I think he he's the he's like you said, he's the icon for today for today's saints, especially for the American saints of these latter times. Latter times, yeah. I'm not trying to like that's not an implicit plug for Mormonism. No, it's more I gotta be now you have me all like insecure when I say something.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:34

Latter-day wait, but no, but it is it look, it they are scary times, and I do love Fulton Sheen, man. So yeah. Um, if you guys can go check out this conference, go check out the website. If you know anybody in the area, pass the word, share the show for uh for Dr. Peter Howard. They're they're doing something important here. So um it was great getting to know you, man. And uh yeah, we'll we'll try to maybe after the conference is over, we'll we'll check back in with you. We'll see how see how it went for you.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:00

Yeah, absolutely. I look forward to enjoying it.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:03

Um uh you you can jump off. We have to actually plug our do our ads and stuff before we wrap up. So if you want to just sign up, we we gotta we gotta do some some ad reads before we sign off. So uh thank you very much, Doctor.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:16

All right, thanks you guys. Thank you. God bless.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:18

Take care. All right. So before we

Wrap Up, Sponsors, And Locals Tease

SPEAKER_03 1:02:20

head over to locals, nicknacks.com, go to nicknacks.com, use code ab25% for 25% off your first purchase, use code AB10 for 10% off all subsequent purchases. Uh BlackMonkrosary.com. Use code AvoidingBabylon at checkout for 10% off your Black Monk Rosary. Um, we are going to head over to locals. Did you uh you probably haven't seen it, but uh I got an email.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:48

The text of Nick Knack.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:51

Okay, so when we were on, yeah, this is actually kind of funny. When we were on locals the other night, I said to Rob, I was like, You think Nick Maxx knows how much we put into their ads? Because like we really put a lot into their ads, and like we're trying to be original here. So uh Nico actually sent Rob an email. You want to read it?

SPEAKER_04 1:03:09

Yeah, he says, uh, you and Ant were asking if we hear the ads in locals. I will I catch every show and they're great. Uh he says if we ever did a bigger meetup, they might be able to make something happen in terms of sponsorship. But sorry, they can't do Bobby's bachelor party.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:24

Bobby, we we can't we can't get sponsorship for the bachelor party, bro. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:28

Now he he does he do he does remind us that we have to say warning this product contains nicotine, and nicotine is an addictive chemical. And he's trying to tell Ant that you don't always need to say it isn't a smoking cessation device. It's a smoking cessation device.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:41

Awesome.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:42

I don't think he's I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:43

He didn't say anything. So if you want to quit smoking, guys, then all right. I'm not allowed, I don't have to always say it's not a smoking cessation cessation device, but I always have to say Nick Knacks contains nicotine. Nicotine is an addictive substance, but you guys know that because you all are getting it because of the nicotine in it. So um, all right, so we're going to head over to locals. Um, and um we have uh what do you I have a couple things I want to talk about. I want to talk about these uh let me see, hold on. I sent Rob something. Okay, so all the the whole encyclical series has been making me think about like what if we actually did get a trad pope? And uh I think it would be pretty terrifying to be honest. Like, not that I don't want one, I think that's actually what we do need, but we'll talk about it over there. So we're going over to locals. If you guys are not locals members, you're bums. We'll see you guys next time. Take us out, Rob.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:44

You can't say that and then expect me to.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:46

You are supposed to have it queued up.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:49

I need I need uh what do you want me to have queued up?

SPEAKER_03 1:04:52

I don't know how long feet. I don't know. You're supposed to give me like 10 seconds to like regroup and see who the hell texted me while we were on while we were over here. Uh all right, Josh is relentlessly fighting with melody lions. I don't know, we'll talk about that. Josh fighting with melody lions is pretty funny. Yeah, that's definitely something we can talk about.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:15

Uh uh and I have to send the address to uh some somebody for work to fly on. How are we doing? Are you cutting feeds off over here?