Vatican Named in Epstein Files? + New SSPX Bishops

Michael Hichborn joins us to discuss recent big news stories such as the Epstein files and announcement of upcoming SSPX consecrations.

Chapters

• 0:00 Glitched Intro And NYC Woes
• 2:10 Layoffs, Weather, And Homeless Crisis
• 3:25 House Sickness And Skipped Show
• 4:45 Setting The Table: SSPX And Bishops
• 6:20 Excommunication As Remedy Or Revenge
• 8:20 SSPX Mission And 1988 Consecrations
• 11:10 Irregular Status And Rome’s Delay
• 13:30 Will Rome Cave Or Stall Again?
• 15:00 Not Luther: Why SSPX Isn’t Protestant
• 17:10 Debt To Lefebvre And Latin Mass
• 19:00 Francis, Faculties, And Truce In Tradition
• 21:10 FSSP And ICKSP As Spin‑Offs
• 23:00 Religious Freedom, Toleration, And Modernism
• 26:00 Ecumenism, Obamacare, And Moral Clarity
• 28:20 Why A Foil To Modernism Matters
• 31:00 Sponsors, KnickKnacks, And Fat Thins
• 34:10 GoFundMe And Lenten Lobster Tails
• 36:10 Epstein Files: Hype Vs Evidence
• 38:10 “Lived At The Vatican” Claim Examined
• 40:10 Data Dumps, Psyops, And Redactions
• 42:10 Pizza Emails And Code Words
• 45:00 Bipartisan Rot And Church Abuse
• 47:20 Networks, Cover‑Ups, And Power
• 50:00 Symbols, Sodom, And Warnings
• 52:10 Reform, Fasting, And Ember Days
• 54:00 Shoutouts And Audience Growth
• 56:00 Closing And Move To Locals

Transcript

SPEAKER_04: 0:04

I guess the intro's not gonna play. No intro at all. We're just jumping on. I'm like it is literally set right set right there to play.

SPEAKER_03: 0:16

It's usually wow that's good. What's crazy is like I usually during that song when it's playing and stuff, like I'll be doing stuff and like you know, getting like my last minute.

SPEAKER_04: 0:56

I guess it did decide to play.

SPEAKER_03: 1:03

What was that? Why did that kick on late late after that, like that?

SPEAKER_04: 1:07

I don't know what happened there, man.

SPEAKER_03: 1:09

Oh, you didn't plan that? It kind of just like did it on its own.

SPEAKER_04: 1:11

Yeah, it just it stuttered, I guess, playing the intro.

SPEAKER_03: 1:14

Man, that was weird. All right. I'm uh I've been cooped up in my house for like two weeks now. Uh I've been off. I I said laid off, and people took it like I like lost my job or something. Like my company, so we have Mayor Mamdani has taken over, and he refuses to make people move their cars to the other side of the street for street cleaning. So we can't find the jobs in the street that we actually have to go and fix and work on. And I can't even put like no parking signs out to make the cars move because he refuses to like there, there's no we're not allowed to do that. Like, there's you just so we're not able to work. I was off all week last week. I'm off this week. The last night I jumped on a show with a couple of guys, had a fun time there. I look forward to just getting on and talking with you guys because I'm kind of cooped up with a bunch of women in my house, and it's like, all right, I can go have some some guy talking.

SPEAKER_01: 2:11

Tell me, how are things in the new Soviet Socialist Republic?

SPEAKER_03: 2:16

This is the first thing I've actually noticed, to be honest.

SPEAKER_04: 2:20

Ah, the 16 people freezing to death was no big deal, right?

SPEAKER_03: 2:27

But up until up until this event, I was like, all right, you know, it's business as usual in the city. It's not it's like the the the mayor of New York doesn't have that much ability to do that much, but he does have the ability to like not force homeless people into shelters during sub-zero temperatures, which has led to them freezing to death on the streets of New York, which is crazy. So just uh yeah, good times in New York, man. I don't know. So we also have uh all right, so locals tonight is going to be we I told Michael he probably shouldn't come over there because we're gonna get into some real real muck and mud. Uh, for those of you who don't know, it has come out today, actually, like just an hour or two ago, that uh Elijah Schaefer kind of flipped his lid and went off the deep end with drug abuse, and it's coming out that's uh he may have had an affair with a well-known Catholic content creator. So we're gonna discuss that on the other side. We're gonna try to keep the the gossip to a limited amount on YouTube. But if you guys want to join us, that's what we're gonna do over on the other side. Um, other than that, how have you boys been?

SPEAKER_02: 3:36

Oh, I've been great. I mean, I'm I'm better than than I was last week anyway.

SPEAKER_03: 3:42

I heard you were a little under the weather last week, right?

SPEAKER_02: 3:45

Yeah, a little bit, a little bit.

SPEAKER_03: 3:47

Uh we had we had the stomach bug go ripping through the family one at a time, and I I was the last domino to fall, so uh it seems like the that God always saves it for the man to have it last, right?

SPEAKER_02: 4:02

Like you I'm glad he did because you know when you're up in the middle of the night taking care of one at a time, uh the worst is trying to do it while you're sick, also.

SPEAKER_03: 4:14

Yeah, yeah, for sure. Uh we're covering. We skipped our our Thursday show last week. Like, I was throwing topics at Rob. I was like, Do you wanna like we were like, All right, look, we can talk about this or this. And Rob was just like, dude, I just don't have it in me tonight. Like, I just I just don't have it in me. I said, All right, so we let's scrap Thursday's show and we'll regroup next week and we'll see if anything else pops up. Sometimes you need to do that, like sometimes like just talking about like church gromo or talking about political stuff because I I don't know, we we could have discussed more stuff or good thing nothing has popped up since then at all, right?

SPEAKER_04: 4:54

And and then and then this week starts in front.

SPEAKER_03: 4:57

This week pops up files, the X bishops and the SSPX stuff, and I'm just like, Oh, all right, well, we got new stuff to talk about at least. Um, which one do you want to do first? It's up to you guys. Uh well, I put out a short video on the SSPX thing on my uh on my ex the other uh the other day, just because I just find it so strange how like gleeful some people seem about like the prospect of excommunications, and it's like and and Anthony Stein pointed out because he actually played my video and he said, Well, I'll I'll throw the reverse at you. If like we heard James Martin was going to get excommunicated, you'd probably have that kind of glee too, right?

SPEAKER_04: 5:42

And maybe, but my uh man, it's I would the thing is like James Martin, like he's already in a really like a state of heresy, right? Yes, the excommunication would be to call him back to the church to try to save his soul. It's not a punishment so much as it is uh a remedy, right? So I would be not gleeful, but I would be happy that the church is actually working to hopefully try to save his soul, whereas you know, uh excommunicating a bunch of bishops who just want to train, you know, good priests seems just to be vindictive more than anything.

SPEAKER_02: 6:23

So there's a train of thought that you have to follow with regard to the SSPX. It starts with the mission of the organization itself. The SSPX exists primarily to stand as a safehold or uh, you know, like uh a stronghold for the traditional sacraments, the traditional liturgy, traditional confession, traditional uh confirmations, etc. etc. etc. That's why it exists. That's that's its whole entire mission is to maintain the tradition of the Catholic Church. Okay. Um unfortunately, what winds up happening is I I'm sorry, I'm distracted by the fact that I see my own handle saying something about a cold start. I didn't post that.

SPEAKER_03: 7:14

I was literally just looking at that. I'm going, oh Michael, are you like delayed? Is it your wife? Maybe uh maybe it could be my wife.

SPEAKER_02: 7:22

I don't know. I was like, wait a minute, I didn't post that. Um so that's that starts as the mission of the SSPX from there, back in the 80s, they had oh Joe McClain says that was his fault. So I guess he was logged in as me.

SPEAKER_03: 7:43

I don't know how you logged in under my oh, I was about to I was about to say hello to Alyssa. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 7:49

Yeah, Joe's, yeah, just says he was logged in by how was he okay, okay?

SPEAKER_02: 7:55

Better change your pillows into my account. Um no, but okay, so it starts with SSPX with its mission. The second step that you have to look at is that the um the SSPX asked for the consecration of bishops in the 1980s, and several times they were told yes, but not yet. And it was delay, delay, delay. Now, why were they delaying? There's no given reason why they were delaying, but Archbishop Lefebvre believed that they were delaying simply because uh yes, I'm sure I'm sure Joe is also um somewhere in Nigeria uh trying to sell or trying to get convince Americans to open their bank accounts for three million dollars. The um uh Archbishop Lefebvre essentially was dying of cancer, and he knew he was dying, and so did the Vatican. And so what was going on here was kind of basically a a a wait and see game, hoping that what would happen is that he would die and they wouldn't have to worry about the SSPX anymore, because no bishop, no oversight, therefore the organization will eventually just fold and go away. That's not what happened. He went ahead with the consecrations. Of course, uh the Vatican came back and said, We're sorry that you did this because now that you've done this in defiance of our orders, you are now excommunicated. But here's the issue the excommunication is not related to an act of def it's not a defiant act against Rome because Lefebvre was told yes, but not yet. Just wait, just wait, just wait. He wasn't told no. So the act of defiance can't it's it's kind of a sideword skew. You can't really call it an act of defiance. Well, anyway, uh of course the excommunication was handed down. It's it's a it's a legal excommunication. You can't say that it wasn't legal, you can't say it it was something that was promulgated and it was upheld by Rome. So, yes, it was an actual excommunication. That excommunication was then lifted by Pope Benedict XVI. Uh SSPX, it was in what was called an irregular canonical status, so it's kind of a strange situation. And now two of their bishops have died, they've got two left. They've been asking Rome for permission to consecrate bishops, and again, it's more of a wait and see game. Uh we don't know what Rome's response was when they wrote to Rome and said, We intend to consecrate bishops.

SPEAKER_03: 10:57

Uh I I I don't think they I think Rome caves.

SPEAKER_02: 11:02

You think they caved?

SPEAKER_03: 11:03

I think Rome caves. I think Rome gives them bishops.

SPEAKER_02: 11:06

Maybe. Maybe. But here's the thing, we don't know what Rome said.

SPEAKER_04: 11:12

Um it kind of seems like we were led to believe they said nothing at all and just ignored it almost. Right.

SPEAKER_02: 11:20

And if that's the case, then there's no act of defiance, which means they weren't told don't do this, which means to go forward with the consecration of those bishops would not be an act of defiance, therefore not an act of schism, therefore not an excommunicable offense. So to Anthony's point, when people sit there and they start gleefully wringing their hands, going, I really hope that they get excommunicated because wow, it's it's a long time coming, those jerks. Uh, I'm sorry, but that's not what's happening, that's not the case, and you shouldn't be hoping that somebody gets excommunicated for something that they didn't do.

SPEAKER_03: 11:59

Yeah, yeah. And I'm I'm tired of seeing people uh act as if the society wanting bishops is the same thing as what Martin Luther did, because that is something you see quite often. Like they're basically Protestants, they don't, you know. It's like, man, do you guys actually understand what the Protestant Reformation was? It wasn't like like they brought up they brought in an entirely new theology and soteriology about the way you are saved, they came up with a whole new ecclesiology, then it became just the Bible alone, and anybody could start that this church planting idea. Like the society is literally just like we just want to continue on with the mission of the church as it always has been, we want to continue with the sacraments and the rites of the church as it always has been. We want to teach from the catechisms from before the council, and all we're asking is that we are allowed to ordain bishops so that this mission can continue. Like, if if the society does not get those bishops, the society dies on the line, like it just it dies on so does the FSSP, and so does the ICKSP.

SPEAKER_04: 13:00

The only reason they exist is because the SSPX exists.

SPEAKER_03: 13:04

Exactly, like it's almost like if the if the SSPX doesn't ordain these bishops, it's bad news for all the indult communities, it's bad news for all the ecclesiade communities, all of them, because really Rome wants to be rid of it totally, and they almost can't because of this resistance put up by the society. So it's like, like, I'm not even a society guy, I'm not I'm not over here. You know what I mean? I'm not even a society guy. I go to a diocesan Latin mass, but the the idea that I would be gleeful at the at the thought of their excommunication is absurd. It's like I I I like what the society does, and I think that it's an important piece of the puzzle. And I think anybody who loves the Latin Mass that thinks they don't owe a debt of gratitude to Lefebvre is delusional. Like every one of you who love the Latin Mass owe a huge debt to Lefebvre. Lefebvre is the reason that the Latin Mass exists as wide as it does today. It was definitely a con, like Sumorum pontificum was a concession because of the society in in some form or fashion, maybe not directly, but it definitely was. It was because Benedict saw there were people who wanted to go to the Latin Mass, but didn't want to be in this irregular canonical situation. So he so he made he made the exception there.

SPEAKER_02: 14:22

Joe McLean said that the Vatican said they hope to work it out before July 1st.

SPEAKER_03: 14:27

So yeah, you have to think about this like how many, um, how much Francis did for the society? Like, Francis grants them the ability to have uh like gives them authority for weddings, for confessions, for like he basically gives them authority to do all the things that were in question before. So, like you would hear I would hear talks by like Father Wolfe on um uh on uh census fidelium years ago. Like, because a lot of people that come to tradition now kind of think there's always been like this calm between the society and the FSSP is that, but there wasn't, there was a lot of hostility between between those groups. Like, really, Michael Matt coming out with Unite the Clans. Unite the Clans is technically about the society and the Ecclesia Day communities like, come on, guys, it's time to stop the hostility. Like, there's because you would hear sermons by guys like Father Wolf and the guys in the FSSP saying, don't get married at the SSPX, like your marriage is invalid, you're actually living in a state of mortal sin. Like you would hear stuff like that, and you don't hear stuff like that anymore since the Francis pontificate. So, I mean, a lot of people coming into this scene now don't really know that context.

SPEAKER_02: 15:42

Yeah, um I I think that there are a lot of people that that don't have the proper understanding of how everything came out to be the way that it is. Uh, you know, you you back in the 80s, the reason that the fraternal society of Saint Peter came into existence is because when Lefebvre decided he was going to um consecrate the the new bishops, uh a bunch of priests from the society drove all the way to Rome to meet with uh Pope John Paul II, and they had a private audience, and and the only way that they were able to have that private audience, because it was the dead of winter and most of Rome was already shut down at that point, and they were able to get that private audience and said, Look, we are loyal to you as Peter, but we still want to maintain our um our identity as traditional Catholics, as traditional priests. Uh, can we start something new? And he he gave them that authority. And the the caveat was you are uh to answer directly to me, not to any bishop, not to anybody else. You are to answer directly to me, which is why it's called the fraternal society of St. Peter. So the um the existence of the society of the FSSP is directly rate related to the SSPX.

SPEAKER_03: 17:07

Yeah, they're breakaway, they're breakaway priests who didn't want to go along in this not even really breakaway.

SPEAKER_02: 17:13

It's more like um more like just uh it's it's kind of like um what do you call it? When when you have one series that that uh spawns a new series on TV, sequel it's like a like a uh spin-off spin-off the spin-off show.

SPEAKER_04: 17:29

Well the thing is then the icksp is like the uh the French version, the French spin-off, it's like Frasier from Cheers.

SPEAKER_02: 17:36

It's like you know, it's like yeah, two wonderful series is just different flavors.

SPEAKER_03: 17:42

Um, the thing is, man, I because I never dealt, I was talking about this last night a little bit, but like I never delved into some of like the deeper controversies that Lefebvre was bringing up, but something like religious freedom, where he was like, No, no, no, the church was never for religious freedom. And that this conversation came up with Joel Webbin when I interviewed him, too. It's like you it's one thing to to have like a separation of church and state and um allow for different denominations of Christianity, but it's a whole other thing when you're talking about like Muslims coming into your country and Indians coming into your country, and then all of a sudden you have Diwali celebrations and you have mosques going up on every corner. Like the danger of religious freedom is not so much about interdenominational disputes as it is about allowing foreign gods into your nation to take over your nation, and then that is the real danger. And then when you look at Noshra Tate and how the Vatican is now talking about how, oh, let's look at the good and all these other religions, it it lowers the guard of your average Christian to go, oh well, this is harmless, and there's nothing harmless about allowing foreign gods into your country, like you're you're it's dangerous.

SPEAKER_02: 18:58

You have to you have to look at the language of the church whenever she talks about other religions and their existence in various localities, it's always been under the terms of toleration, yeah, not in terms of freedom because or or uh or a right, okay. Nobody has a right to perpetuate a lie. Nobody has a right to believe a lie, nobody has a right to practice a lie, and all false religions are lies. So when we start looking at these false religions, whether they're heretical sects, uh, whether they are uh pagan sects, whether they are um, you know, the the two Abrahmic religions, the two Abrahamic, you know, Abrahamic religions, you know, it doesn't matter. They are false religions. They are false religions, and they've got to be recognized as such. So the problem that we have now within Catholic circles is that they're trying to to give this well, they they call it ecumenism, they call it interfaith dialogue, but ultimately it's just a bunch of talk to try and push global socialism because all they all they're really trying to accomplish is a bunch of kumbaya, let's all get together and hold hands and and work together for the common good. It's it's garbage.

SPEAKER_03: 20:23

It's it's it's even more diabolical than that. It's like when you even think about when Obamacare comes into effect, and you have like the little sisters of the poor are being forced to provide birth control, right? And and we have that lawsuit that comes up, and they're like, Well, we're not going to like it's it's against our faith, and we're not going to uh we're not gonna pay for uh abortiface and drugs or whatever. And the bishops go and fight that battle on religious liberty grounds. Instead of the bishops coming out and talking about the evils of contraception, like it then becomes oh religious freedom. Like that's that's where the the Catholic mind has gone because of the documents of Vatican II is that we no longer talk about intrinsic evils and mortal sin. We just go, oh, religious freedom. Well, we shouldn't have to do this for religious freedom reasons. It's like our bishop should have been all over that for the intrinsic evil of abortifacient drugs, for the intrinsic evil of artificial birth control in general, and the whole conversation shifted, and it's all because of this ecumenical outreach that we got, which is what Lefebvre was against initially. And it's like he it's man, you think of a guy who was just so prophetic in what he saw, like he just saw the consequences of this council, and he's like, You can't make deals with these guys, like you can't he's like, You can't make deals with these guys, they're all modernists. He's like, What deal am I to make with a modernist? He goes, You you want me to come in and just have unity for the sake of unity? But like, there, these are real issues that need to be discussed, and the thing is, yes. like like i i get i get what i get what people are worried about but like man if it's not for this group standing up and saying no these issues need to be hashed out we'll never hash hash them out like they need to be hashed out we need to actually get to the bottom of them all the ambiguities in the council need to be clearly defined and they won't be without the society like the society plays a very vital role in my opinion I agree I agree I think they because look every good drama requires a foil and you've got to have a protagonist you've got to have an antagonist and unless and until somebody stands up to the modernist monster in the room to point out the errors that are going on and being perpetuated through the church's hierarchy continuously all the way to the top uh you're you're not going to it there's not going to be any drama there's not going to be any resistance and it's just going to be the push of a lie going through the channels that calls itself the Catholic Church.

SPEAKER_02: 23:04

And I I want to be clear about what I mean here. I'm not talking about the Catholic Church proper. I'm talking about individuals within the church who hold certain positions of authority.

SPEAKER_03: 23:15

They be they bishops be they priests be they cardinals okay with those positions of authority when they start pushing these modernist ideologies and they've been doing it for the last 120 years by the way this is why we had the the syllabus of errors this is why we had the um the oath against modernism uh even even through the 19 uh 40s and 1950s you had uh Pope Pius XII talking about the very serious errors that were rising up and how even then people kept trying to get him to uh to change the mass and to monkey with the mass and to change the liturgy uh you know Vatican II didn't happen in a vacuum but without the without the SSPX I agree I don't think that there is any other organized resistance to stand up to the modernism that's taking place it doesn't mean that they're right in everything that they do but I think that's they play a very important role play an important role as you said yeah uh a couple things okay so for anybody that just tuned in we're about to do the Epstein stuff we're also a lot of people talking about the Sarah stock Elijah Schaefer stuff that's going to be on locals tonight um we're gonna do that over there trying to protect Michael's reputation I don't want to involve him in that kind of smut talk uh before we before we change gears over to the Epstein files I definitely want to discuss that uh we have to mention our two sponsors so uh recus and sellers we still love so you guys could go to them but they're gonna take a little break till after Lent but we still have Nick knacks and Nick knacks is uh um our our favorite new sponsor right now nicknack.com shop use code a b 25 for 25% off now knickknacks are nicotine lozenges i'm not allowed to tell you guys that they are a smoking cessation device like I can't legally tell you guys that man I quit smoking for these years just tell you guys but we are legally required to say that knick knack contains nicotine and nicotine is an addictive chemical I'm gonna say this so make sure you buy a multi pack I always well here's the thing like I I always I always uh like even with Zin I would go for the wintergreen or the mint flavors and that was what I went for first with the knick knacks and I was like all right let me go with these and I was like oh they're all right dude my favorite flavors of knick knacks are lemon and tangerine the blood orange is good too blood orange is good too like the fruity ones are phenomenal so if you guys do like typically like if you typically use a pouch like if you go for an ALP or a Zin I promise you you guys will not regret making the switch over switch over to Knickknacks Knickknacks are amazing. 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So uh nicknacks.com guys go go check them out the FDA comes after us I'm I'm just telling you out I did not say they're a smoking cessation device that's not what I'm telling you guys they totally are um and the other one is fat thins fat thins are a small Catholic company they just started off uh we love fat thins if you guys use code ab 10 for it's so confusing that they don't all just we gotta come up with a unified like uh uh you know code for every company that uses us then they have to all use the same percent off yeah so maybe we just gotta do like a b I don't know something all right but yeah fat thins is awesome so they're potate they're making potato chips and they only use sea salt and um potatoes sea salt and beef tallow and beef tallow they uh are delicious rob says they're his favorite chips ever I would love to say the same but my kids and wife eat the bag every time they send them to me I think I've tried two chips and I enjoyed them very much but my wife and children love them so go check out fatthins.com use code ab10 at checkout for 10 off your first order last time we mentioned them they sold out of their entire stock when they when they came on so we're hoping that happens again if you use the first product does it cause you to crave the second no actually it it stops you from craving the second ah yeah so eat the chips first then you eat the chips first unlike unlike normal chips you eat a handful of these you feel like you ate something substantial actually oh okay Michael we have so we had recusant wines and we have knick knack nicotine we're like oh man we became drug dealers I don't know how like our potato chips drug dealers and now so we're we're literally just just like we're we're we're selling people vices and we're a catholic show I don't know how good this is alcohol nicotine chips it's not good but just say that you're handing out advice don't smoke eat fat things instead Joe says uh before we move too uh move on too much from this um a friend of my wife's uh does have a gofundme they um they're unable to work due to an in an injury right now so they are um they're running behind on like rent and bills and stuff so I'm gonna throw a link to their GoFundMe they're a young Catholic couple um I'll I'll personally vouch for them so they're good people and they could use some help and the link um will eventually be in the description but for now I'm gonna pin it into the live chat for anyone wait I cannot listen we we have a Lent sponsor coming up guys that is so good Michael we have i i mean i'm gonna just shout them out because they sent us a package shoplobster.com sent rob and i lobster tails dude they sent us a box of four pounds four pounds of lobster tails each i invited my in-laws over the other day and I'm like guys I'm making lobster tails and like I made surf and turf I made steak and lobster tails for my in-laws the other day dude I learned how to butterfly lobster tail and prepare it and like bro like hey I am so good at preparing lobster tails now I'm about to order more from them they're so freaking good but we figured they were a good Lenten sponsor because you got you can't eat meat during Lent so Jeffrey Anthony was the sponsor of it um we I think we sell drugs and children guys so bad and here you were protecting my reputation from yes Michael we want to make sure we don't involve Michael in the smut okay so speaking of Jeffrey Epstein there's been there's been what a segue there's been uh there's been a whole lot of uh gossip on the internet about um Jeffrey Epstein's um uh uh decorator talking about him him jeffrey epstein living at the Vatican and you know when you lived at the Vatican with JP2 and you saw those columns and we're gonna do the columns about when you lived at the Vatican then there's another there's a couple about the Vatican Bank where Jeffrey Epstein's like well a bigger story than the Pope being changed is actually that there's going to be a new regime at the Vatican Bank and the Vatican like like I mean look you go back to you want to know one of the biggest Catholic videos ever was is Taylor Marshall breaking down the Vatican Bank scandal with Benedict yeah talking millions and millions of views that video had yep and it's a really interesting um it's a really interesting tale that you learn about the Vatican bank and then that honestly involves when Francis comes in and he does his like his cardinal nine cardinal panel right it's like it's like the fellowship he brings in or something and he brings those nine cardinals in and cardinal pell gets put on the panel for the Vatican bank and he tries to start cleaning things up and all of a sudden after he starts cleaning things up all of a sudden Pell gets shipped back to Australia to face charges for child uh for for child endangerment or something and then he finally gets cleared of his charges and he comes back and he mysteriously dies in some run of the mill operation that happens like there is a lot of intrigue after people are telling him do not have this operation at this hospital don't do this at this hospital yeah it's kind of kind of crazy like the cardinal pell stuff is the one thing that definitely is something to think about but the the the orthodox like the ortho bros online are making such a big deal out of this one email about oh jeffrey epstein lived at the Vatican first off it's such a ridiculous assertion like it's so absurd that Jeffrey Epstein lived at the Vatican first off this would have happened in like 2003 before anybody even knew who Epstein was like he might have just been like a big finance guy I don't there's no record of him ever living in the Vatican it's just an email that might have been misworded to say he like he could have vacationed there or went there to visit or something.

SPEAKER_02: 32:38

Yeah I think he might have stayed in the grounds for a day or two at the time but like who knew who he was back then so here here's the thing there are a couple of things here number one um I I've been to Rome I've been to the Vatican I've I've stayed near the Vatican you there there are uh Airbnbs all over right around the Vatican city state that you can stay in that it's you're basically saying for shorthand hey I stayed at the Vatican um you know it's not like you're staying yeah what does it mean to stay in the Vatican or at the Vatican there are apartments there. There are certain cardinals that live there there are certain uh members of the Curia that live there but when you say I live at the Vatican or I live in the Vatican you're not necessarily living within the city state proper or within the the walls of the Vatican city state it means that you're you're somewhere near where the Vatican is that's that's right you might be on Vatican Hill Yeah you know the look it's it's not it's not a big area and there there are a lot of hotels there are a lot of Airbnbs there are a lot of places to stay so it's it doesn't necessarily mean what they are trying to make it mean and the information is so scant with with very few details that it's it's it's a big fat nothing burger. They're trying to make it make more of it than what it is. That's that's really the problem there. And I found that I found that to be the case with a lot of stuff coming out of the Epstein files there's a lot just because somebody's name is mentioned does not mean that Jeffrey Epstein was you know had a relationship or or had something to do with the individual that was uh mentioned in the in the documents.

SPEAKER_03: 34:38

It's it's kind of crazy Rob actually pointed this out to me I should let Rob say it but uh he might have forgotten that he said it um he he he texted in our group chat the other day he was like like it almost seems like a psyop the way they release the Epstein files it's like they just throw these three million emails on us and it's like anybody can go and pick through and find anything they want and make any everyone can prove their own pet theory that they've always thought for years.

SPEAKER_04: 35:04

There's something in there for you to hold up and say I was right no matter what the heck you believe.

SPEAKER_03: 35:11

And and there and to and to an extent that's true but at the same time like the way they released them it's like nothing's going to come of any of this. No.

SPEAKER_02: 35:18

And well the that's yet to be seen there was there was an email in there uh from Jeffrey Epstein to somebody whose name was redacted and the the text of the email said did you torture her? Which is uh I mean you can't really weasel those words and say he meant something else. No that that was a direct question. The re the the thing we need to be asking is who did he send the email to and why was the name redacted? The only reason I can think of as to why that particular name would be redacted is because for legal reasons to maintain the integrity of a case they have to keep that redacted so that they can then prosecute uh in a proper manner.

SPEAKER_03: 36:10

Otherwise the uh the information gets to be um polluted so you got to be careful man because I like I don't I almost don't want to say this on air but I drank a little so I will um recus um so uh I saw one of our friends who I consider a very good friend I just spent the weekend with him but John Henry Weston put out a tweet the other day about like because Jeffrey Epstein had a tweet about the Latin mass in it and it's like I mean John Henry just miss misread what that actual tweet was and it was kind of a uh I think it was a bad take on his part basically so uh Jeffrey Epstein was passing information on to Steve Bannon because Steve Bannon was inquiring about a Latin mass and he said hey if you're in this area go to this parish is very similar to Holy Innocence in New York and John Henry Weston took it and it kind of goes to Rob it wasn't even it wasn't even it wasn't even Jeff it wasn't even Epstein telling it was Epstein asking someone else for information on the Latin mass in this area that person sent this big long paragraph about the Latin masses in this area and Epstein forwarded that on to Steve Bannon and that was it and that's all it was and like some people saw it and they were just like this is proof of it's like come on man you guys got like the we're missing so much context from so many of these emails you're getting these little snapshots and it's like oh his designer said that he lived in the Vatican it's like guys we don't know anything like these are all just out of context emails and you're going to find some nonsense in them and it's gonna like Rob said it's like you're gonna be able to prove your pet theory about so it's like it's it's the way they release it is intentionally done to confuse everybody lead to more just conspiratorial thinking and you're gonna be all over the place nothing is going to come of this stuff. Now what I can say if you go to the Epstein files and you type in the search bar just the word pizza gets 859 results and I've been through a lot of the uh the documents that talk about pizza and and uh I'll tell you oh no I mean 100% right audio only listeners so somebody somebody wrote a b is good at balancing low IQ anti-Semitism from ant with high IQ anti-Semitism from Ralph sorry made me laugh I had to say it so going going through the pizza stuff though what it does you you start looking for the things that are being said and the things that they're they're actually uh putting forward they do seem to confirm a lot of the pizzagate stuff from 2016 uh yeah you know you you start to see some of the same uses of the word pizza especially when they're talking about pizza as if it was a person and not something that is to be consumed on a table. Um hitch regretting this episode so much I'm sorry guys I'm sorry I'm a little over the place no Michael you're 100% right though like the the Pizza Gate stuff because there was the Wayfair thing too the Wayfair stuff yeah yep not just Wayfair but what was what was that other one? It was um oh there was another company that that was that had the euphemisms for purchasing people effectively not Wayfair but it was uh oh well sports betting but yeah I can't I can't think of it right off the top of my head yeah there was one guy kept emailing emailing him he's like you have two steaks left on the island would you like to bring more steak to the island you know it's like well we're we're dealing with disgusting creeps don't get me wrong I'm not like I'm in no way defending any of it what I'm trying to say is the way they released it just seems like anybody's gonna be able to pull anything out of it and try to make it fit their own little thing and it's like especially um when I'm I'm watching order a pizza just go to PMT uh oh I you just threw me off but um what's what's interest interesting to me is like we all I mean we all knew it was uh you know underage like an underage sex ring and with some of the Pizzagate stuff and connections to um uh what's the artist's name uh Abramovich right yeah oh yeah like like the the whole pizzagate stuff seems yeah but um with all all the mentions in the files about some of the uh uh the Amish uh stuff the Jewish stuff like it is it is strange how how much it seems to correlate to to historical stories we are told are blood libel you know um things like the murder of Simon of Trent and in other such you know stories or events or whether they're historical or or not it's hard hard to say but I mean there does seem to be a connection even up now until modern times. This is this is a good point. It's like we're okay so like we're complaining about the way they released it but like they were releasing nothing before and it's like either you release it this way or you stay with the cookie cutter stuff they were releasing before I prefer it this way.

SPEAKER_02: 41:57

Yeah I'm glad they did release the stuff don't get me wrong it's just like I would like to see them follow through with some investigations with all the names that they redacted like I mean some of the stuff you heard about the Bushes and the and and like oh did you see the mention of Bush in there man I mean that was horrifying it's like oh we can release this one because Bush died so it's like all right yeah we'll we'll let you see this but the idea that because there are so many people who are like MAGA cultists or diehard Republicans who thought this was like a Democrat thing and it's like don't you understand where oh yeah no no no look I I went through uh a lot of the when when the um oh what was it the uh grand jury reports would come out regarding priestly sex abuse in various states I read through almost every single one I could get my hands on over the last 10 years and I've been reviewing and reviewing and reviewing everything that I could find and one thing that I I will never forget is reading about uh priests who would identify children uh altar boys by putting a gold cross around their necks and then pass them around to other known pedophile priests in a it was literally a trafficking ring among these priests and the bishop knew about it. So you know you have these um these rings that are going on then you look into uh Archbishop Weisenberger who out in Detroit who is a known fixer known for covering up all of the things that are going on in a particular diocese and he goes on and and gets made archbishop of one of the most important dioceses archdioceses in the country uh as a thank you for his services uh and you know you've got uh cardinal worrell and you've got Theodore McCarrick and you've got The uh the guys up in in New York, uh who was it? Um uh in Buffalo, uh Clark, Matthew Clark, and uh uh the other guy, I can't remember the other guy's name, Albany. Um Hubbard, Mother Hubbard. Um over and over and over again you see that there is some sort of involvement in child trafficking among the episcopacy, specifically in this country. Uh we've we've seen um with Catholic charities on the border has been heavily involved in moving people across the border. How many hundreds of thousands of children went missing after they were aided unaccompanied across the border? And why was it that Catholic charities at the border got so much money to uh assist unaccompanied minors coming across the border but got nothing with regard to human trafficking? There's there's something off here. They should have been aware, they should have been paying attention, and you know you start putting the pieces together, and there's something wrong. I will never forget when Pope Francis, and I'm trying to remember where he was, uh I think it was in 2020, and he was it was some group mass, maybe it was a youth event. I I don't remember. But the vestments that he's wearing, they're blue vestments, and the fringe along the edge of the vestment are these triangles. Oh, yeah, I remember that. Yeah, oh the uh it's the pedo symbol. Yes, it was from pizza. Literally, literally the pedo symbol. It's the same color blue, it's the same pattern with the same number of movements into the interior of the triangle. Why?

SPEAKER_03: 45:59

What you know okay, so like I always I I uh I find the priesthood was probably a safe place for somebody who might have struggled with same-sex attraction, like that didn't want to get married. It was probably a safe place for them to go, right? So I I would imagine throughout history you did probably have some percentage of people that were like this in the priesthood, but I think at a certain point when you get to like where um uh uh Fulton Sheen talks to Belladod, right? And I think there's this active uh attempt to overtake the like the Catholic priesthood with men with this predilection, and then it gets to a point where once they get to the levels of of bishop, it then like in the 60s and 70s and 80s, it gets to a point where once they're in positions of power, they only elevate other men with this predilection. And now we're dealing with the consequences of this happening from that period in time. Whereas, like throughout history, I don't think it was like this. Like, I think there might have been a couple that got in just to avoid speculation on why they're not married, things like that. But what happens once you get to a certain point in recent history is it becomes like a club where they once those men are in positions of authority, they just start elevating other men with the same problems. That's what, like the whole McCarrick thing, what that was really about, him going out to that house out east with them to go and you know see which ones would stay in better. That was him feeling out which men he could elevate to put to higher positions. And it was like, oh, if you wanna, if you wanna it was like pay to play with a guy like McCarrick, and that's the situation we're dealing with now, and it's gotten to the point where now those men will be the ones in charge of what kind of vestments the Pope is wearing, like that's how high up this stuff has gotten at this point, you know.

SPEAKER_02: 48:01

It's well, yeah, but you know, you want to talk about there's nothing new under the sun. Um, Saint Peter Damien lived from 1007 to 1072. Okay. He wrote the book of Gomorrah, which was primarily about uh ecclesial homosexuality. And as a quote, this is a quote that he that he himself gave. For God's sake, why do you damnable sodomites pursue the heights of ecclesiastical dignity with such fiery ambition? There's nothing new under the sun. So we've got St. Peter Damien as a model. This is a thousand years ago, a thousand twenty years ago. Okay. We have a similar circumstance where right now in the Catholic Church, we have these these sodomites who work among themselves, they circulate and they they network together, they bump each other to certain positions, and they operate the same way communists do. Communists they don't want to take over the apparatus, they just want to hold choke points because if you hold the choke points, you can control everything without having a large number of people to do it. Uh, that's what the the uh homosexuals in the church do. They hold certain key positions like, oh, I don't know, uh nuncio, they hold key positions like uh the most uh influential cardinal in the in the country to play kingmaker to make all the recommendations as to who should be made bishop next in the United States. There are plenty of great, great priests in this country that would make wonderful bishops, and they will never ever get elevated, never right, because they're not part of the club, yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 49:48

Yeah, this is what I this is why like when when when I talk to guys and they're like, Oh, but there's so many young conservative priests in seminary, and it's like, yeah, but you're not understanding the levels of power that are held uh amongst amongst these men at this point, like they're not those those conservative priests are not going to get elevated, like we're in a situation now that is so catastrophic it's going to take the hand of God to to fix it, you know. Oh, yeah, it just is.

SPEAKER_02: 50:19

I mean, I think that the symbol of Sodom is fire falling from the sky. What was it that Our Lady of Akita said?

SPEAKER_03: 50:27

It's a good point, Michael.

SPEAKER_02: 50:29

You know, yeah. Why why is it that we're being threatened with fire that would destroy two-thirds of humanity? I mean, it seems that uh if if the only way to to get rid of this particular vice is by fire, then we will be faced with a trial by fire.

SPEAKER_03: 50:49

Yeah, and it'll be just that's what's crazy. It's like it'll be it'll be just. It's like it will we'll we'll completely deserve it for allowing this nonsense to to to happen, and it's it sucks for the faithful who don't want it to happen, right? The faithful who just want to live our Catholic faith and go about our business. But the thing is, even us, like there's so many things in our lives that we could could be offering up a sacrifice and penances for like the idea that we have like that we got rid of um like days of fasting and penance for the clergy, the um like the it's just crazy that the church did that after the council.

SPEAKER_02: 51:34

Well, why is it that our lady consistently asks for prayers for the Pope?

SPEAKER_03: 51:39

Yeah, because Satan is looking to sift him like we that's right, yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_02: 51:44

And I think that uh what we're witnessing right now Ember Days is what I was thinking of, right? Ember Days, yeah, yeah. Ember days, Coles.

SPEAKER_03: 51:53

Yeah, I'll tell you, this is actually I was gonna, I was just gonna say somebody just pointed this out. This is the first time we've had over like we have like 480 people on YouTube and a thousand people on my actual uh uh extreme right now. If you guys give me a like and subscribe, we'd appreciate it. And while while you're all here, go uh subscribe to Lapanto Institute on YouTube, also. Uh uh Michael is one of our favorite guests, if not our favorite guest. Everybody always loves when Michael comes on. He's uh he brings an element of sophistication to our show that's not usually there.

SPEAKER_02: 52:31

Um, yeah, it's just like uh Joe McClain was calling your show the Cleveland Browns of of uh of I did see that.

SPEAKER_03: 52:38

And another Joe Joe McClain just moved to afternoons. I want to give a shout because Joe's in our chat tonight, and it Joe's not usually in our chat because Joe goes to bed at seven o'clock typically because he had to be up at 3 a.m. And now Joe is an afternoon show, so it'll be a little easier to get Joe on. Uh Joe will come and join us soon. Um, I I would always go to work and jump in Joe's chat in the morning, so it's nice to see he returned the favor a little bit. Um, but yeah, go go check out. Um, is Joe's uh show name the same still?

SPEAKER_00: 53:07

Yeah. Act. A Catholic take.

SPEAKER_03: 53:11

A Catholic take with Joe McLean. I always just look just look up Joe McLean on YouTube and you'll find him. But yeah, Joe's show is uh in the afternoon now, which I I'm I'm very happy about. He I don't know if he's happy about it, but I enjoy it.

SPEAKER_02: 53:23

Um I'm glad that he's on at four o'clock in the afternoon because now I don't have to get up super early to be honest.

SPEAKER_03: 53:31

Like, I don't have a day off, and I'm like, all right, Joe, I'm off today. I'll come on your show, and I still gotta wake up like I'm going to work. But no, we love Joe. Joe is uh Joe's Joe's definitely awesome. Uh so yeah, go check out a Catholic take, subscribe to Joe McClean's YouTube channel. Uh, especially with him moving to afternoons, like I want to I want to make sure everybody shows him as much support as possible. Uh I saw he had Michael Matt on. Michael Matt's another interesting one because I think Michael Matt put out a couple of bad tweets leading up to his take on the Minneapolis stuff, and most people are reacting to his tweets rather than what Michael's actually saying. And if you actually go and listen to his shows, like he he it, it's not I know Rob, you've been going at it with Michael Matt a lot, but you'll even admit you haven't watched any of his shows, you're kind of just going based on Twitter, and Twitter really saying our city, our city, our city, and then he lives 50 miles away. Twitter's just a terrible medium for like complex thought because anytime you write anything over 280 characters, nobody reads it. It's like so you know, Rob Rob and Michael Matt have been going at it a lot on Twitter lately, but I think I think he does have a few good points. So Rob is insisting that he ruins every relationship we have in this business. It's kind of fun, honestly.

SPEAKER_05: 54:55

I don't care.

SPEAKER_03: 54:57

I'm not your I'm not your boss. You can say whatever you want, do whatever you want. But uh, all right, so we're gonna wrap this side up. We're gonna go on the other side and we're gonna talk about the Elijah Schaefer Sarah stock Sarah stock drama. I'm not usually Michael joins us on locals. I told Michael I'd rather not ruin and sully his reputation. So it's probably better we let him go. Michael, give Alyssa our best. Um, tell her, tell her uh we thought that she was in the chat tonight. We were very excited for a minute, and we found out it was Joe McLean, and we immediately were disappointed. Opposing is me. Yes. Uh, all the best to your family. Uh okay, guys, go check out Rob is still trying to ruin the relationship with but he just won't let me. No, that's not even that's not even wrong. Rob has like purposely tried to crash this podcast on multiple occasions. Like, nope, you're not getting rid of me, dude.

SPEAKER_04: 55:52

You won't let me just drop them.

SPEAKER_03: 55:53

It's not happening. No, no, no, you're stuck with me. Um, all right. So we're gonna go do Elijah Schaefer sour stock stuff over on locals. If you guys aren't local supporters, that is where we have all the fun. You guys are missing out on the best part of the show. If you're not local subscribers, come join us on locals and we're gonna get into the the next Catholic Inc. content creator to go down the road of debauchery and try to fool all of you. Michael, thank you so much, man. Go check out LePonto Institute on YouTube and check out Lepanto Institute.

SPEAKER_02: 56:22

Is it.com or LePontoIN.org.

SPEAKER_03: 56:26

Lapontoin.org. Michael, we will get you on again soon. Thank you so much, man. You've been a great friend of the show and we love you. All right, love you too, guys. All right, we'll see you next time, brother. All right, we'll see you guys on the other side. Take us out, Rob. Uh, we'll go with this one.