Avoiding Babylon
Avoiding Babylon was started during the height of the COVID-19 pandemic. During these difficult and dark days, when most of us were isolated from family, friends, our parishes, and even the Sacraments themselves, this channel was started as a statement of standing against the tyrannical mandates that many of us were living under. Since those early days, this channel has morphed into an amazing community of friends…no…more than friends…Christian brothers and sisters…who have grown in joy and charity.
As we see it, our job here at Avoiding Babylon is to remind ourselves and those who enjoy the channel that being Catholic is a joyful and exciting experience. We seek true Catholic fraternity and eutrapelia with other Catholics who, like us, are doing their best to live out their vocation with the help of God’s Grace. Above all, we try to bring humor and joy to the craziness of this fallen world, for as Hillaire Belloc has famously said:
“Wherever the Catholic sun doth shine,
There’s always laughter and good red wine.
At least I’ve always found it so.
Benedicamus Domino!”
Avoiding Babylon
Trump Preparing the US for War (Full LOCALS Show)
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Avoiding Babylon +
Access to the FULL show on audio!It feels like the world is slipping its old skin. The postwar order promised stability through institutions, trade, and liberal democracy—and then ran headlong into culture, religion, and power. We unpack why those fault lines matter right now: Fukuyama’s “End of History,” Huntington’s “Clash of Civilizations,” and the uncomfortable ways their ideas echo in Ukraine, Europe’s identity crisis, and America’s defense build-up.
We talk frankly about an exploding Pentagon budget, pressure on contractors, and what a creeping wartime command economy really signals. If your supply chains run through rivals, if your munitions lines are slow, if your energy is fragile, deterrence becomes theater. We explore how two decades of counterinsurgency left the West unready for attrition, drones, and industrial-scale logistics—and why that matters far beyond headlines. This isn’t cheerleading; it’s an honest look at costs, risks, and timelines.
But politics alone can’t explain the ache under the surface. Civilizations are built from stories, rituals, and faith, not just rules and markets. When meaning collapses, people reach for identities strong enough to bind them. That’s why Europe’s cultural drift, mass migration pressures, and loss of confidence feel like more than policy failures—they’re spiritual. We share a practical path that resists despair: invest in parishes and friendships, relearn skills, protect families, care for priests, and live the liturgical year with intention. Resilience starts close to home.
If you’re trying to make sense of Ukraine, NATO, energy security, AI, reindustrialization, and the rising talk of great-power conflict—without losing your soul—this conversation is for you. Listen in, argue back, and take what helps you build where you stand. If this episode resonates, share it with a friend, subscribe for more, and leave a review to help others find the show.
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The nothing ever happens to him. I'm gonna kill him. Every time I see like whenever anything happens, I think of his face. Whenever anything in the world starts to happen, I see his face in my mind's eye.
SPEAKER_05:You think maybe it'll happen just as once you've got to be able to do that.
SPEAKER_02:Those clips were are many. I hope I mean we if we still get a copyright, I'm gonna kill him. I know, but it's hard. You need music. Yeah, you kind of did, and that intro was freaking awesome, man. Um, and uh for those of you who haven't heard, two more leftist agitators have been killed in Portland. In Portland, Oregon. A husband and wife.
SPEAKER_04:It's like hey, at least they were actually married.
SPEAKER_02:It's like like I I all right, maybe we shouldn't laugh about it, but like it's Portland, dude. Portland, like Portland is completely, I don't even know what country is anymore.
SPEAKER_04:Minneapolis is not far off at this point.
SPEAKER_02:Man, some some of these big cities have gone off the deep end, but um, we are going to get into it tonight. So yesterday, Rob and I, Rob called me yesterday. He goes, Hey, give me a call real quick. And um, he started explaining uh about a book he studied in college. Two of them. Uh, and I was like, this is the most interesting freaking thing ever. I know because I don't know the books. Um, but I love the title, The End of History. I've heard about them, and I was like, I was like, let's just save this. I said, save this and let's just make the whole show about this on th on uh Thursday. So that you know, that's the plan. And then I think over on locals tonight, I'm just going to go off on the ortho bros because they are so annoying. Holy cow, are they annoying? They're just so under my skin, some of them.
SPEAKER_04:It's funny when you act with um a big you know, orthodox account, or what you think is a big orthodox account, and then you look at their account and they have 1,500 followers, and you're like, oh yeah, that's right. That is big for the orthodox.
SPEAKER_02:Well, it's just something I've noticed between like the Protestant converts to Orthodoxy versus the Protestant converts to Catholicism. We'll do we'll do that over on locals. Um, but first, I just ordered three bottles of recusant wine, Rob. You did? I ordered three bottles of recusant wine to celebrate.
SPEAKER_04:But if you celebrate or to drink Way 2026 at this point, no, to celebrate.
SPEAKER_02:Uh, if you guys can go to recusyncsellers.com, use code based at checkout for 10% off. Recusent is awesome. They have supported us through some of the most insane things we've said. Uh, they've never told us what not to say. They've well, other than when we mess up the ad itself, yeah, like when we make fun of them or something. Like, yeah, all right, come on, relax, man. Um, but also, uh, no, they're just I'm like, I'm very grateful for RecuSynt, man. Like, it's hard to get sponsors for a show, and I know our audience is loyal, and you guys love to support us, so please go and check out RecuSyncellars.com. They have an awesome selection of wine. I ordered three bottles of wine. I don't think they have fruit in the winter. You could check, but they do also uh uh deliver fruit around the country. Uh very, very wonderful family, and they are very supportive of us. So please go to reckycentsellers.com. Use code based at checkout. I use the promo code, I don't know if that's wrong, but I'm getting my two off.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, I use you're getting paid for the people.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so I better get a discount on the wine, right? Double dipping.
SPEAKER_04:Is it yeah? Because shouldn't I get the wine at cost? Okay, but you're getting paid 10% of the wine that you ordered at 10% off. Oh, that's you're double dipping.
SPEAKER_02:I don't know what I did was morally right, but I wanted 10% off. That's all I know. You so I use code base to check out, but I got the three bottles of wine to celebrate. Sorry, Jason and John. Sorry, I got the three bottles to uh celebrate because I'm doing this to rob one time and one time only. I am not going to do a big Italy pitch every time the show starts. This is going to be a one-time thing, and then I'm going to clip this segment and I'm going to put it on the channel separately.
SPEAKER_04:Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. Let me get let me if you're gonna do this, let me get the image you just sent me without notifying me.
SPEAKER_02:I can talk while I can talk while you're getting it. Um Italy pilgrimage is finalized. I have the flyer and I have the itinerary. We had to add an extra day because I didn't realize when we planned the 10-day pilgrimage, it landed the last day on the Feast of the Immaculate Conception, and I was like, no way are we traveling on the Feast of the Immaculate Conception. So we added an extra day, and on the Feast of the Immaculate Conception, we will now be having mass. We will now be having mass on the Feast of the Immaculate Conception at the chapel where Saint Francis received the stigmata. I think it's called the Chapel of the Stigmata. So that will be the final day of the trip. Uh we are going to Rome, we will see the Coliseum, we will see St. Peter's Basilica, the Sistine Chapel, we will see all four major basilicas. We are going to then head down to Pompeii. We are going to go to the island of Capri. We will be down by Naples. We're going to spend two nights down there.
SPEAKER_04:Why is that not working?
SPEAKER_02:I hate this. You are butchering my whole pitch here. Typical avoiding Babylon. So we are going down from Capri and we are coming up to Assisi. On the way up to Assisi, we will stop at um Lanciano. We will have a traditional Latin Mass in front of the Eucharistic miracle at Lanciano. Yes, it is a we will have Latin masses on this pilgrimage. Now, I I'm not pitching this as a Latin mass pilgrimage. I do not want anyone who is a lot, no salvation outside the Latin Mass person.
SPEAKER_04:Like if that's if that's who you are.
SPEAKER_02:No, I don't want any autistic trads on this trip. No, it's going to be a Latin Mass pilgrimage. We will be having uh so in some of the most beautiful basilicas on the planet, we will be having use code based check. We will be having Latin Mass at some of the most beautiful basilicas and cathedrals on the face of the earth. Um, we I was a little worried about that. I'm actually gonna have a conversation with Taylor Marshall to like uh figure out some logistics and stuff. There may be one or two places where it's just not possible, and those are the times we will have a novice order. If it's like if we want, I mean, if you want to have mass at St. Peter's, I think you have to have a Novus Ordo. Like, there's if it's possible, we'll have a Latin mass. Like anytime it's possible, we're going to, right.
SPEAKER_04:Um, so unless you want the Latin mass like in the hotel, uh correct.
SPEAKER_02:I'd rather I'd rather have it at some beautiful that'll be at Orientum. It's going to be it's going to be a beautiful um uh novus order in that situation. Just to put them on the spot here.
SPEAKER_04:No, I honestly I do not feel like arguing the entire um are you okay with having uh a priest say uh Leo's name in the canon?
SPEAKER_02:If that's serious, get the hell out. So listen though, what what what I plan on doing is this this is going to be different from any other pilgrimage before we go. Yes, so like tail, and I'm not trying to knock those guys, those guys are a bit way bigger than us, and they probably should get way more money than us, but it's at least a it's it's it's eleven hundred dollars cheaper than any other pilgrimage around. I tried to get it under four grand, but because we added the extra day, it's just not possible. Before we go, I am going to once everybody uh gets their deposit and we know who the group is, we're going to do a private show. I'm gonna have Father come on, and him and I will do a private show with everybody that's coming. Any questions you guys have at you'll get a chance to do. Am I at least invited to that? Of course, of course. Um, any um any that's subtle shot you think of me.
SPEAKER_04:So uh what you have another priest who wants to come.
SPEAKER_02:So um, you guys will get a chance to meet father, and you're gonna get a chance to meet each other. So if you're like uh a single person, come like you will meet P you're gonna meet other single people there. Father is coming with four people. I have single people already booked for the trip. Um, I have some secret info that I can't say because it'll blow the person's spot, but there's other things that are happening. If you're a woman who's always wanted to see Europe but you're afraid to, there'll be a bunch of chivalrous men there that will watch your back. There's gonna be a lot of single guys there, any age bracket. I don't care where you are, please come. We're going to get to know one another before we go. We're gonna start a WhatsApp group chat. So this way, here when we get there, we feel like we're meeting up with old friends. This will not be like any other pilgrimages going on, but we're also only going to have like 25 or 30 spots available because I already have like 15 or 18 spots filled. So we're only doing one bus, we're keeping it a small bus. Um, I mean, we're keeping it at one bus. We're not gonna we want to make sure that we all get to know one another and that we have a really uh intimate experience with each other. You're gonna make lifelong friends. It's gonna be an amazing time. Email Anthony at avoiding Babylon if you would like to come, if you're interested. And I'll try to I'll send you guys the itinerary, I'll send you the flyer, you guys will get all the information you need. This is like the one big pitch I'm going to do on this show. After this, I'm not going to bug Rob about it. So um, I'm wondering if I'm missing anything. Uh, hold on. Yeah, you are. I'm sure. I don't know what it is, but I'm sure you are. Um Father just sex me goes. I'm looking at the flyer. I just see pics of Pompeii, and I was like, Oh, wait, we actually have dead bodies on the flyer. That's pretty that's pretty that's on brand. That's on point. I'm just glad they're not in suitcases. Callback. Oh, that's a callback. That's like you gotta be a long time listener to know that reference. Oh boy. All right, so now on to the subject at hand. So Rob yesterday, um, he tells me about this book that he read when he was in college. And two books, two two books, right? And they were basically two competing ideas for now.
SPEAKER_04:When give give me, give me a little bit of a rundown, Rob, because I so uh we talked about it on Tuesday's show a little, but for those who didn't watch, um in the the in international relations, political science, there's two big uh competing schools of thought when it comes to how nations and peoples interact with each other globally. You have what is called the liberal school of thought. Um, and and these names are different than how they apply politically elsewhere. The liberal school of thought is the the idea that peoples and nations can get together with um can get together and create these global institutions to manage uh international relations. Things like the you know, the League of Nations was like the very first example, but you have the UN and you have different NGOs, um, you know, things like honestly, like USAID, right? It wouldn't be such an example. Lots of different things. So any the idea of using institutions globally to solve the world's problems.
SPEAKER_02:Then you have before before you even move on, so that that like kind of brings so much context to they're trying to destroy our democracy, right? Like the whole lead up in the campaign on Trump saying they're he's going to destroy our democracy because right that like in in their mind, like he's he literally is destroying their democracy, their ideas right, right, right, right, right, exactly.
SPEAKER_04:Um yeah, honestly, the whole the liberal school of thought is very against populism, right? Uh in any nation. They don't want any nation doing things on their own for themselves, right? Because that that destroys their whole idea of how the world should work and does work and and so on and so forth. Um so the competing school of thought is realism, political realism. And this that's the you know, that's um you get the term realpolitik uh from the or the the the name realism comes from realpolitik, but it's the idea that nations and peoples um act in their own interest, right? And and and um more or less global politics is a zero-sum game where you're either a winner or a loser, and you need to act in your own interest, and that actually, by all nations and peoples acting in their own interest, that creates the honestly the most stable international uh system that makes it predictable in a sense. Um, so those are the two schools of thought. And then um what happened is that at the end of the cold war, you you had these two schools of thoughts kind of come up with theories for what was gonna happen now.
SPEAKER_02:What when when did these when did these books come out? Like when was when were these theories supposed?
SPEAKER_04:The first one uh comes uh from the liberal school of thought and it's by Francis Fuki Fukiyama, I think. Um it's called The End of History. That came out, I want to say 88, 89, 90, something like that. And then you had uh the author Samuel Huntington, I think it's Huntington, Harrington, I think it's Huntington. He replied back with his book called Clash of Civilizations in '93. So um right when the Soviet Union was collapsing, transitioning into Russia, right before you had the trouble in Yugoslavia and the Balkan startup, that's when these two theories came out. And the to get just a brief rundown, uh the liberal school of thought from Fukuyama, the the end of history, is the idea that after the cold war, now that the that bipolar um era between Russia and the US is over, and all that's left is um basically uh the West, but they don't think of it like that. Uh all that's left is the things like the UN and NATO. Then now we've reached the end of history, we've reached enlightenment in a sense. Now we will use democracy and and liberal values to to rule the world all united and kumbaya bullshit.
SPEAKER_02:Now, is this the new world order in their minds? Like you always heard like Bush Sr. talk about a new world order, and yes, like is that essentially what they're going for?
SPEAKER_04:And they're just like um because the the the institutions created uh by by like Europe and the US after World War II that really you know ended up winning or being on the winning side of the war, things like the UN and the the whole Bretton Woods international financial system, things like that, those are the institutions they planned on using to uh rule after this end of history. So, yeah, that is the new world that that is what Bush really was talking about. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Um, so man, it's just it's just amazing because of all the things we've been talking about on this show. Feel I feel like they're all culminating in like this conversation.
SPEAKER_04:All right, so now what's the opposing view? So Huntington, who is a realist, um, a couple years after uh the end of history came out, came out with his book Clash of Civilizations, and his theory um was that instead of and this is more of a I guess a neorealist theory, instead of the world breaking back down into individual nations that will all uh act in their own interest against each other, the world will likely break down into uh civilizational blocks um based on like culture based on culture, religion, things like that. Um, and I actually have a map. You got the map. I have a map, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And isn't there a similar map that like the World Economic Forum has out that's kind of like breaking the world into segments, or is that this map?
SPEAKER_04:No, this would not be from the World Economic Forum. They would not like this map. Okay, uh, this map is everything they're trying to prevent in a sense. Let's see if I can get it up. Um, it gives you an idea. I I think I can maybe get a closer there.
SPEAKER_02:We go. Which is interesting because you see Australia, I guess because of their culture and language, they speak English, they're basically uh made up of English prisoners, is how it started, right? So they they they group them in with e uh western Europe, North America, and Greenland.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, yeah. So you have the the dark blue, which uh Huntington called the Western world or Western uh Christendom, um, which is basically uh Central and Western Europe, the North America, uh at least the Anglo North America, um, and then your other Anglo Anglo colonies like uh Australia. Um he has the Philippines included, he has New Zealand.
SPEAKER_02:Is that the Philippines? South America?
SPEAKER_04:Look on South America. They see the one little dot of blue. British uh might be British Guiana, something like that. So it's it's part of Britain. Okay. And then the the light that that light is French Guiana, so oh beli, yeah, it's Belize.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_04:Um, so then your other big blocks, you have what he calls orthodox civilization or orthodox Christian, which is basically Russia and Eastern Europe. You have Green, which is the Islamic worlds of North Africa, uh, the Middle East, um, Western Asia, and then of course, like Indonesia and Malaysia. You have what he calls the Sinosphere, which is basically China, uh, Vietnam, um, Taiwan, and Korea. Um, what other names? I forget what other names he uses here. Latin America, which is pretty simple there. Sub-Saharan Africa, the Hindu civilization, which is really just India, um, Buddhist civilization.
SPEAKER_02:So basically, yeah, well, you can see now how how all this gets screwed up with mass immigration of these other groups into Western.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, so so I I think largely we look at this, and a lot of it makes sense, and we would agree with it, but they're you know, like you said, this came out in 92.
SPEAKER_02:Philippines are in Asia, Bobby, I know, right?
SPEAKER_04:Um this came out in '93. So there's a lot of stuff that has happened since. For instance, we've we've seen a lot of um, you know, I mean, we see we see right now, we see uh Europe and Russia fighting over, you know, this part of eastern eastern Europe, basically, right? Um, Ukraine, uh Belarus obviously is on the Russian side, Ukraine, you know, uh Europe wants it on their side. Um you know, some other interesting areas. Well, just in general, like Europe, I would no longer put Europe alongside with the US, you know, like the a lot has changed where I and this that's gonna be, I'm sure, something we'll talk about deeper. But yeah, but okay, so the the last all right, so we we went to the point. But a couple things I want to note that that are interesting. One Japan by itself, right? It's definitely not part of China, it they're not Buddhist, they're not Hindu, right? But they're definitely not American either. So Japan is by itself, and then there's one other nation that is by itself, and that he has completely separate, and it's this little one right here, Israel. He just lists it as Israel.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, they certainly are their own entity of their own, aren't they? Yeah, um, yeah, so all right, so now how do you see the because because we talked about on locals the other night, like we went up putting it up on YouTube because I just thought it was an interesting conversation that we got into. We were talking about just you know the tensions growing in the US and talking about the the the what we think Trump is trying to do, right? And it it's man, because I I've basically watched all the influencers take sides in this, and I've watched everybody kind of just get in line behind their favorite influencer, and I don't know nearly enough about this stuff, but I do I have had a sense for the past year that we are hurtling towards war. Like, I it just it felt like um when we when we when Trump came in and the doge stuff happened. I'm like, okay, so we see all this corruption, what are they going to do? And then they have their budget come up and they passed the same exact budget. Like, we saw all this corruption, we saw they were sending money to um Afghanistan for transgender studies and all this stuff. And now we know what that money actually was, though. That money wasn't actually going to transgender studies. What it was doing, it was going to these NGOs in foreign nations so that these NGOs could be on the ground and affect political outcomes. Like this is how they would get, you know, they they'd fund these operations. They would basically be, you know, um, USAID would like set up like a vaccine thing, but really they're fomenting revolution in that country. And this way, here, if anybody's politics steps out of line with the Americans, they could just flip that country and put put another person in however they want. So I saw Trump Doge starts exposing this stuff. Trump basically shuts down USAID. And instead of like trying to fix the budget, because we are spending more money than we make, and we are heading towards a financial cliff. Like it's it's unstoppable. But you could have stopped it if they actually wanted to. Like, you have Trump in, you have a total Republican Congress. They they could have done something about all of this corruption and fraud we're seeing. You could have done a lot of stuff to try and get a handle on something.
SPEAKER_04:To be fair, that financial cliff only exists in the liberal post-war order under the Bretton Woods system. You know, when people, you know, obviously our money is is fiat currency, right? In a sense, there's nothing backing it, except there is, and we just have been unwilling to make that more obvious up until recently. It's like the US dollar is backed by the American military, yeah, right? Like, yeah, China holds all a ton of our debt.
SPEAKER_02:So if we get yeah, like if we go to war with China, it's just like you ain't getting your money. I don't know what to tell you. Yeah, right, exactly. It's essentially what it is. Like, like the only thing pre like the biggest thing preventing war with China is how much money China would lose making that gamble. Like we would just we would just fault default on the debt, and and then we don't actually have any national debt because they own all of our debt. Um but I I'm still looking at what was happening, and I'm saying, like, there's actually no effort whatsoever to fix the financial cliff that we're heading towards.
SPEAKER_04:We're hurtling towards it, and they're just like, Yeah, under the current system, it it can't be fixed. No, I mean it it so I mean, how are you gonna what are you gonna do?
SPEAKER_02:Oh, you could try to cut spending back, at least even make an attempt at it, but they didn't even make an attempt at it, right? No, so then Trump tells us he's going to end the war in Ukraine on his third day in office. I'll end it in the before I even take office. But he gets in and I'm like, he's not ending anything, and not only is he not ending anything, he's continuing to fund this. He's he's coming up with excuses for why we have to send more money over to Ukraine. He doesn't even he doesn't even cut off any of the spending over there. And I just started seeing it as oh my gosh, man, like they they're we've we've been talking on this show for how long about the end of the Holocaust narrative, and they need a new thing, like they need a new event to basically base this, whatever they're doing, like whatever they're doing, they need a new a new event to base this next uh republic on, right? So so we're we're watching what Trump's doing, and he's he's basically kicking Russia and China's influence out of places where he wants the American influence, saying he's going to buy up Greenland, he's trying to like hedge hedge up the the Western hemisphere essentially. Now, but your your point is this needed to happen for 30 years already. It's it's like it's a good thing that he's doing this.
SPEAKER_04:Not needed, no. So you world war one, you had you had Christendom basically commit suicide, right? You had you had Europe go to war against each other and and kill off an entire the the best of an entire generation, all in an attempt, really, to to overthrow the like I said, the the the Christian system of governance, um, even though it at that point it wasn't largely Christian, but um to overthrow it and create you know the the liberal system of governance under under the League of Nations, which was really the first attempt. That didn't work because uh as terrible as World War I was, you had the peace itself was was worse for nations like Germany. Um, you know, you had uh even even nations who were on the winning side like Italy got so screwed over by Britain and France and the US that the peace for them was terrible too. So you had you had these nations that that you know they try to use the horrors of World War One to force this new system of governance on the whole world, and even the US, you know, you had Wilson, Wood Woodrow Wilson create the the League of Nations, yeah. But the US still was so isolationist at that period, um which is a good thing, that there that the US was like, no, we're not gonna join. So you had the creator of the the League of Nations was the US president, and the US didn't even join the system. Um, and then you had nations like Germany and Japan and Italy, um, and others who who, of course, drop out uh, you know, within 10, 20 years. Um, and of course, the League of Nation falls apart, and you end up getting World War II. Uh, but then that was so terrible. And of course, you know, maybe other narratives were created or exaggerated to make it seem even more, you know, terrible enough to where the whole world then joins into this this liberal international order.
SPEAKER_02:Um all right, so how do you how do you see like I because I I'm I I I look at it like this what Trump is doing right now actually does need to happen because if we go to war with Russia and China, like we have to actually protect our country.
SPEAKER_04:And we we shouldn't phrase it that way. War is coming to Russia, China, the US, and the rest of the world, right? Because the world has fallen. We've you know, since the beginning of time, the world has fallen. Something like this the international order, according to to the the political liberals, you know, they're trying to build utopia on earth, right? They're trying to do it through through these ideals such as democracy and and things like that, and it they just do not work in a fallen world, you know. The closest the world has ever really come to a to a global, supernatural, supernational organization that could effectively you know manage nations was the church.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, Joey, stick around because Joey, stick around because that's kind of where I'm going to end up going with this. I know I know this is like a little bit of a slow start, but we're building to something.
SPEAKER_04:So um okay, I want you to play the but they they tore that down, yeah, and try to replace it with you know a god of their own making, and that that's it's falling apart, and the world is going to revert to the way it was, right?
SPEAKER_02:So we we had a conversation last March. Um, it we had it, it was it was after I went away with my wife for a weekend, and this is kind of like when all this stuff just started hitting me, and I was just like, We are going to war. Um, the the war in Ukraine, when I saw Trump wasn't stopping that, I was like, We're going to war with Russia. Like the deep state basically spent 30 years antagonizing Russia by setting up in Ukraine, trying to get Ukraine into NATO. Russia kept saying, Stop, don't do this, just you know, you guys are right on our border. And it eventually led to Russia overtaking Crimea, and that led to the the Ukraine-Russia war that we have now. Trump said he was going to end it. Not only did he not end it, he kept antagonizing it. So I want you to play the clip from a year ago. There's two of them. I want to just I want you to play it because where I was coming from, which is where you were coming from. The the one uh um the one where you're in it, because there's one with just me and Nick are in it. Um which one is it?
SPEAKER_04:I have it.
SPEAKER_02:I think it's the top one, so it would be uh the whole episode from last March.
SPEAKER_04:Okay, let me get it ready.
SPEAKER_02:So this was this was uh this was a conversation we had, and like I came back from this trip, like doom and gloom, and you were like rolling your eyes at me, you were like thinking I was nuts. But I kind of I don't think I was nuts, but I think that me and you just see reality from different perspectives, like um you have uh such a different way of thinking than I do. I wasn't actually looking at geopolitics in any way whatsoever, where you definitely have a better understanding of geopolitics than I than I do, especially in like Russia, and like that was like your you know, like you definitely understand that stuff way better than me. I wasn't going based off of like things I was seeing in the news as much as it was like seeing this through the lens of the Christian story and just seeing us hurtling towards the Battle of Armageddon, you know. Uh does it really?
SPEAKER_04:We're gonna try to be better for audio listeners since Anthony has now realized for the fourth time in a row, fourth year in a row that we actually do have audio listeners. Uh the comments is this stream is more live viewers than Raymond Arroyo right now on EWTN.
SPEAKER_02:Oh boy. So all right, so let's let's play the clip because you you you were pushing back on me, but I want to know what you why you were pushing back on me and why you thought I was nuts. And it has your view changed at all since then.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_04:No audio. No audio. Okay, give me a second. I gotta change this real quick. The settings are a little I mean, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:That whole episode, if you guys go back, I the the episode was called um uh what the heck was it? Uh hostile takeover of the Catholic Church. And it was because we still had Francis. Francis was still the Pope. Uh Leo hadn't even uh taken office yet. Francis was sick at the time, but I went back and I listened to it and I was like, man, everything I was saying then I haven't changed my view at all on, and it feels like we're we're actually like moving closer towards the things I've been thinking about.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, let me restart this. Why is it so quiet?
SPEAKER_04:Is it quiet for everyone?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, okay. It's a matter of not wanting to blackpill, which I understand. It's like I don't I don't want to believe I'm at the end of the world, you know what I mean? And we might not be. It's gonna be any episode, by the way. It doesn't make the situation in the church any less grave.
SPEAKER_04:No, the situation in the church is definitely the most grave aspect of it. It's it's your assessment of the geopolitical situation I disagree with for the most part.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I don't I think we're going to war with Russia, dude. I just do not want that. I know they don't do not want that. America wants it. And we'll keep dude. We have just done parts of America want Europe wants it. I Europe wants it and America wants it. Trump may not want it, but I do think it's out of his hands at this point. Let's all right, let's play the Raymond. It's funny we played a Raymond Arroyo clip right now, actually. Did we? Yeah, we because we were playing Cardinal Mueller on Raymond Oroyo. It's a funny little callback, but um, so okay, so I wasn't looking at it from a perspective of like, does Russia want war or does I I mean I did see like the American deep state antagonizing this thing for 30 years, and I'm like, there's no way they're just gonna scramble their multi-billion dollar investment in this situation because Trump wants to end it. I don't, you know, I didn't see that happening, but really it's more about the dragon in and in the way I was looking at it. Well, maybe, but it's more like the book of the apocalypse where the the beast that was is not, and then we'll come back, and it's it's all the stuff we talked about with Joshua Charles, where the the dragon is bound um for a time when when Christendom spreads, right? So you have the pagan the pagan world, you have demons all over the place, they're they're worshiping these false gods, and then Christ comes and and God binds the demons beneath the earth, and that's the time period where Christendom spreads, and that's when God's spirit covers the earth, and all the pagan nations convert. And when Christ says, uh, when you lift me up, I will draw all men to me. That that like that prophecy is insanely true. He we look at the cross and he draw all drew all nations to him. And there's a time at the end where the where that dragon is unleashed and God releases releases the the the the beasts from from under the earth. Now that also has to do with um like Cornelius Alapiday's reading of a star that falls from heaven is always representative of a bishop, and this is a bishop with keys, and he opens the key to the abyss. I was also looking at it from a perspective of the story of Job. Like this is all done by God's permissive will, like God allows this stuff to happen for you know for his purposes. So, what what I was seeing was just us hurtling towards this financial cliff. Trump gets in, he's this he's like a this character that we've never seen in politics ever before, and we're just going full steam ahead at this thing, and and that's how I was looking at it. I wasn't looking at it from a geopolitical perspective at all, but but you always are, which is why it's kind of interesting. Like this whole conversation, you kind of changed my mind on I would have taken uh the Venezuela stuff. I've seen Voice of Reagan's Dragon. Um, the Venezuela stuff, I would have taken the libertarian position. I'm so I'm I'm surprised you didn't take the Faser Gordon I I I probably would have yeah, I probably would have gone with the um Dave Dave Smith, like this is another far, yeah, like like arguing as if this was Iraq. Like that was my initial instinct, like Trump doing regime change. That was my initial instinct on this, and I held off. I was like, Don't jump in this, like pay attention to what's going on right now because I just saw every like I saw the Fuentes fans getting behind him, the libertarians going this way, and I saw this guy going this way, and I was like now to be clear, not that it matters because we I thought we were pretty clear last episode, and yet from the comments, none of you flip and listen, but to be clear, we're not even necessarily defending the whole Venezuela thing. Oh, yes, there were people in the comments thinking that we were like excited for yeah, like we're like, Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Not even remotely close, we're just trying to see what's happening and and understand what is happening. And like I almost went that route, just just that was just my initial thought. I'm like, Oh, we're doing this again, you know. And and the thing is, social media is funny because you'll you'll catch people putting clips up and you'll be like, Oh, that prove you know, and I I did almost fall into that, and then I started thinking about it, I started. Um, looking at it from your your point of view a little bit more, and saying, all right, maybe this isn't what's going on there, but what Trump has done in the past few days is both like securing, like he okay, like this is actually in Americans' interest, right? He's doing this in America's interest. This is like this kind of is an America first thing because he's he's he but he but it's also he's gearing up for war, like there's no doubt about it or the possibility of it, yes. Uh yeah, I I just feel like the same thing I felt back then is that it's almost out of our control, right? Like it's not, it's not what it's not like yes, we're preparing for the possibility, but the possibility is inevitable because of this under like we're we're dealing with principalities and powers right now. Like, there's just there's no level-headed speaking, there's no coming to the negotiating table. Like, we have such a beautiful country, we have such a beautiful life. We all could just have such nice lives, but these men and their power games, they just can't help themselves. Like, this is just the this is the story of all history. This is just this is all of history, it's always happened.
SPEAKER_04:Well, and and the why the reason you feel like you know it's all collapsing when we're heading for something inevitable is because it is like the world order as it's been for the last 80 years was a house of cards. And when a house of cards comes down, it comes down hard and it comes down fast and it comes down uncontrollably, right? The reason why I and I I don't I I'm not gonna say I know how that looks or how that ends, but the reason why um none of this surprises me, or the reason why uh I don't look at this as like as a apocalyptic as you is because like I believe uh when it comes to this stuff, like I I am on that realist side, not in the sense that I believe um might makes right or you know or or or that power is everything, but I do believe that in our fallen world, the most stable system is one where everyone, you know, whether they be um where where nations need to look out for themselves and do what's best for themselves. And a lot of times what's best for a nation is to not attack another nation because they're they don't know, you know, when when you're a strong nation and your enemy's a strong nation, you don't necessarily don't want to attack them, yeah, right? But when but when you're Russia and you're next to a whole continent of weak nations, because those weak nations have given up their sovereignty to nuclear power all the way across the ocean because they're part of some crazy little club called NATO, yeah. Well, that's what creates instability, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:But when we were saying it's it's like we were saying, like China, the amount of money they would lose because they're carrying all of our debt, right? Now, I didn't I didn't understand the Ukraine war until me and you have had conversations, right? Like, I was just like, why are they doing the why what is going on in Ukraine? Why are we doing it? But like we've been in the freaking desert fighting what's that a really racist thing there. We've been in the desert fighting fighting fighting Muslims for 25 years because of Iraq, Afghanistan, and all that stuff, right?
SPEAKER_04:And it should be very clear to us now that that was like an attempt to prop up the crumbling world order, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it was almost probably an attempt to form another narrative, like 9-11, and they but it wasn't strong enough, that was never going to be strong enough, and uh, but like you're saying, like George Bush goes over there, he's like, We're gonna spread democracy, not the gospel, we're not gonna spread the gospel, we're gonna spread democracy, you know. Like, like the that is the gospel to liberals, to them, yeah, 100%. Um, but what you what you realize is that the Ukraine thing is us actually now we have an understanding of how Russian tactics work. Like you said that the uh army ordered a whole bunch of different uh new rifles, right?
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, yeah. So uh a few years ago, the the the the military is always running these weapons, uh these programs to find the next weapon, right? They do it all the time, and nine times out of ten, they decide not to adopt anything. Well, a few years ago they did one for a new rifle because we've been running some variant of um the AR-15 M16 now since the 60s, and uh they surprised everyone by actually selecting a new rifle. Um not to get like too uh too autistic in the fight and the gun stuff, but um the reason they did that is because um because they're preparing for or they they want to prepare for a war, you know, where they're we're we're fighting Russia or China, something like that, you know, uh a near-peer adversary who is gonna have body armor, like you know, supposedly decent, although other stuff's crap. But the idea is we're fighting someone with body armor, and we want a rifle that can fire around, that can reach out a thousand yards, you know, over like the European uh you know, force or something, uh, and punch through body armor at that distance. That's great, except we just have seen you know what uh what are we going into almost four years of a war now where no one does that? Where we've built trenches, and it's if and when when two enemies actually see each other in person, it's in a trench, and the rest of the time they just send a little you know drone with some plastic explosive on it to go kill a guy a thousand yards away. Like that's all they do.
SPEAKER_02:So that's it's like we so we go and we're you so we're basically burning Ukrainian lives to figure out how this next war is even going to happen. Like, you you we needed to see what Russia is capable of. We needed to actually test this stuff out. So maybe that's why we're over in Ukraine. I don't know. I mean, I'm just and once again, guys, we are not defending anything or cheering for anything.
SPEAKER_04:We're trying to objectively look at why things are happening the way they're happening, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So so, like, what other purpose do we have over in Ukraine, right? It's uh do we need them in NATO that bit? No, it's it's we've been we've been in the desert fighting Iraqis and Afghanis for 25 years. Our military and weaponry has been designed as bunker busters and to fight these rebel forces that are hiding in the mountains. We are we are now have to look at what happens if we go up against a world power and not some rebels. So it maybe that's what we're doing over in Ukraine right now. Um just the all of these things because I what Joey was saying about Akita, because I we never really go down the apparition road, like we I always try to stick to scripture and just the story, right? And I dude, I want you to be right so bad.
SPEAKER_04:Like, this is all just like it's I I'm not oh my gosh, do you I swear people don't listen to a damn thing. We did we mention anything about Russian tactics? No, no, the word wasn't even said. We're not they're testing out technology and testing out new tactics. And if you don't see that, then I'm sorry, you're blind, you're deaf.
SPEAKER_02:And you're you're finding out how the next war is going to be fought, and what and what you're finding out is that it's actually not gonna be these soldiers on the ground firing rifles, it's gonna be this drone warfare, and it's gonna be the we're trying to see what kind of weapons they have. We're trying to say, like, we're just maybe, and I'm not even saying that's actually what's happening, I'm saying maybe that's part of what is going on there. People really do only hear what they want to hear, and they really do, especially with stuff like this. Yeah, and maybe I'm sure you guys know more on this topic than I do. I'm sorry, I'm doing the best.
SPEAKER_04:No, you know, the thing is, the thing is, I they might think so, but most really don't. It's because they've just learned what they want from other influencers, right?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I'm I'm and I don't pay attention to this stuff, I'm going based solely on the story, right? So, like I want you to be right, I want this just to be kind of like a global reset and just a different position of powers and things like that, but then I always have Akita and Fatima in my head, and I have a city in ruins, and I have a lady of Akita saying the living will envy the dead nations, entire nations will be wiped out, things like that that haunt me, and it it's it because I man, I have to be really careful talking about this stuff. Like, my son comes to work with me, and it's like you don't want to do that to your 20-year-old and just like telling the world, like I don't want to do that, you know. So I'm trying like I want to be wrong on this. It's just the way things are playing out, it's it just seems like that's what the world is hurtling towards. Um maybe it's just kind of a reset. Maybe like maybe America continues on in a different form, but play the Tucker Carlson clip because I'm like I'm not nuts. I know other people are seeing what I'm seeing. Play play that Tucker clip, and it's like a minute and a half clip from his monologue this morning. Where I mean, this is what what I've watched the past couple of days is almost identical to what I have felt, and it's what I've been talking about for nine months. And when I when I did talk about it back in March, everybody still had like MAGA excitement. Like Trump had just come in, he's signing all these executive orders. Everybody, like everybody destroyed me in the comments for having I had Nick on the show. Nick was you know, Nick, Nick's freaking Mr. MAGA, and I was starting to talk negatively about Trump, and I got lambasted in the comments. And I'm like, I'm telling you guys, I'm not like I don't know. This is just kind of like a like a sense I'm getting. It felt like a spiritual sense I was getting like God was putting it on my heart almost.
SPEAKER_04:You I don't know why you sent me the clip like that. I can't play it like that.
SPEAKER_02:Why not?
SPEAKER_04:Because it has to be in a chrome tab. Oh, you know what? I'm doing this differently than hold on, hold on. It's been so long since we've really done this. Give me a second, I just gotta open it and chrome. I'm stupid.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, I'm not that's how I always do it, so okay, here we go.
SPEAKER_04:I wonder why everything was looking so different tonight. Okay. Okay, if Anthony did say the word tactics, I apologize. I mean, but even still I'll be honest. A lot of the words he says during the show, I don't actually hear. We talked about my Gaspers the other night.
SPEAKER_02:You if he did, if he did say that, I apologize. You and Gasper, I'll tell you guys what happened the other night with him and Gaspers. If you guys show saw the short I put up, I like I did like a little bit of like a minute and a half monologue where I went and then I stopped and a half or whatever, however long it was, but I stopped waiting of you talking waiting for one of you to jump in. But you were reading the comments, yeah, and Matt was probably looking at something on his computer, and I stopped talking to you.
SPEAKER_04:Both were like, Oh, wait, and instead, you make it look like we're afraid to talk about the Jews. Now, I don't know about him, but I you we all know I'm not. It was people are like, I guess you're just afraid to bring up the Jewish question.
SPEAKER_02:It's like, no, Anthony caught me off guard. Yeah, everybody was like, Matt and Rob are free to talk about the JQ. All right, play the Tucker clip.
SPEAKER_07:Is think through where this is going to go in the next several years. Like, what does the world look like five, ten years from now? Well, today, about an hour and a half ago, the president announced that he is hiking the Pentagon budget from one trillion to one point five trillion. Just announce that. Why? Well, it's hard to know without asking him, he'll explain. But big picture, obviously, that's the kind of budget that a country that anticipates a global or regional war has for its military. There's no other reason to do that. That's not a peacekeeping budget, that's a war budget, a big war budget. So I think it's fair to expect, and all the signs suggest, that we're going to have a big war soon. A big war soon. I think everyone expects that to happen. Hope it doesn't happen, but obviously we're moving in that direction toward a world war. Sorry.
SPEAKER_02:So like, okay, so now Tucker then goes on to say how we need to make sure we have an alliance with Russia, because I think Tucker feels the same way I do, that we're hurtling towards war with Russia. And he's terrified of that because like we don't, I don't, I think about all I my my biggest thing is that the the West has abandoned our God, and we are due for a chastisement. Like, that's that's where my fear comes. It's not that I understand the geopolitical situation whatsoever. I only see this through the Christian lens, and I just see we've abandoned our God, and I look through salvation history, and anytime God's people uh start to play around with idol worship, um and he Anthony talks for 15 minutes straight without taking a breath or letting anyone get a word in edgewise, then says Matt and Rob, you need to contribute to you want to know why we're a little gun child to talk because the second we ever try, he right he drives right over us.
SPEAKER_04:That's not true.
SPEAKER_02:I if I ever hear you like if I even see you like trying to perk up the same, I try to shut up. I've learned I've learned a little bit. I do try to give a little, a little, you know, I don't know, boisterousness to the show. So all right, so so Tucker's kind of like afraid of the same thing I am. Trump, I remember when he came in, he wanted to increase the budget to a trillion and everybody flipped out, and now he's bumping it up to a hundred and i mean uh 1.5 trillion. He also tweeted this out yesterday, um, or put it on truth social. Um guys are the worst. Uh all United States defense contractors and the defense industry as a whole, beware while we while we make while we make I'm sorry, I gotta expand this. My eyes are terrible, getting old. Uh, while we make the best military equipment in the world, no other country is even close. Defense contractors are currently issuing massive dividends to their shareholders and massive stock buybacks at the expense and detriment of investing in plants and equipment. The situation will no longer be toler tolerated. Also, executive pay packages in the defense industry are exorbitant and unjustified given how slowly these companies are delivering vital equipment to our military and our allies' salaries, stock options, and every other form of compensation are far too high for these executives. Defense companies are not producing our great military equipment rapidly enough, once produced, not maintaining it properly or quickly. From this point forward, these executives must build new and modern production plants, both for delivering and maintaining this important equipment. He's basically reaming out the defense contractors for giving their big wigs these dividends and pay packages, and he's saying, You guys aren't even keeping up with what you're supposed to be doing. I want this money put back into the weapons to maintain this stuff.
SPEAKER_04:If you it I don't know if you remember, but when um when Russia first invaded Ukraine, um I I forget if we had someone on, or if or if you took the position that you more or less like um that that at least initially it was gonna be over fast, or or that uh that you know that that Russia would run out of stuff.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_04:And and I said something along the lines like no, because even though America has up way more, way better technology, right? Way more advanced technology, we do not have the industrial capacity to produce munitions. Like, for instance, uh when they use those um those uh those penetrators in Iran for the the the against their nuclear program. I think that was if it wasn't our entire stock of those uh those penetrating bombs, it was like 80 to 90 percent of the stock, and they build at least at their most recent pace, one or two a year, and we use 14. Wow, like yeah, it would take it it would take a decade to get those back.
SPEAKER_02:Let me ask you something. Do you think like if we went into a full out war, like could we turn the the war machine back on like we did in World War II? Oh my gosh, I do that. Holy cow, I'm not even repeating that for the audio only, guys.
SPEAKER_04:When I said what I because I I couldn't remember, um couldn't remember the acronym, and I'm like, oh no, I'm gonna have to say the word penetrator. I'm like, oh no. Um anyways. Wait, what did I just say? Do do could we turn it back on?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, could we turn the war machine back on like we did in World War II? Like but we had all these factories and stuff back then. Like, if we went full-scale war, could we get it together as a nation?
SPEAKER_04:Eventually, could we do it fast enough? I don't know. We we don't have the physical infrastructure, right? So we'd literally have to build factories with what steel? We don't have steel mills, mills right now. All the good steel steel, uh don't know why I can't say that word, comes from Germany. Are we gonna be their ally at that point? All the crappy steel comes from China. We know we don't want that, and two, they won't give it to us. So do we then do we have to rebuild our steel mills? How many guys know how to how to how to you know make steel?
SPEAKER_01:Scary stuff.
SPEAKER_04:So all right, so and where are we gonna get the iron ore from? A lot of most of the mines in Minnesota have been closed, they won't let it make they won't let us make new ones, you know. What about all the rare earth minerals we need for all the fancy uh chips and all of the missiles and things right now?
SPEAKER_02:We get most of that from China. I'm looking at it like when we have to get the Manhattan Project done, it's like we get it done. Like we're Americans, we get it done when we have to get it done, and it's like that didn't require massive plants to be built. Yeah, I understand. Um, all right. So this guy, if you want to bring this tweet up, I thought it was really good. So he this guy says, uh, Trump is building a wartime command economy without declaring war. He's not trying to reform the defense sector, he's preparing to subsume subsume it, strip the strip the optics. What he's doing is establishing direct state control over strategic capital flow using loyalty pressure, populist framing, and fiscal levers. He's not negotiating with defense executives, he's declaring them subordinate. This is a test run. He's setting precedent to apply this model across sectors. Energy will be next, AI after that, healthcare eventually. The pattern is simple. First off, I don't know about healthcare.
SPEAKER_04:Do you have to go with an AI written article?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I didn't. The pattern is simple. Any industry touching sovereignty, logistics, or frontier technology will be absorbed under mission state logic. Private firms will hold the equity, but the state will dictate the capital structure, production cadence, and narrative frame. Buybacks are forbidden, dividends are conditional, salaries are capped, output is mandatory, time is compressed. It's a shift from incentive alignment to compliance enforcement, from persuasion to control, from make it defense great again to You now work for me. No modern president has dared cross this line because it exposes how thin the veil of corporate independence actually is when national purpose is invoked. Trump just crossed it, and the deeper layer, this only works if he's confident the military capital markets and the public market lie. Huh? What do you disagree with?
SPEAKER_04:No, it's just AI.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_04:No, no human wrote this.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, you could tell. But either way, the points still stand. Like what he's doing is he's basically putting in a wartime. Like he's put he's putting pressure on defense contractors and saying, you're doing what I say. Like he's not, he's not uh he's not passing things through Congress anymore. This is why I kind of have this feeling um that he's not going anywhere in 2028, guys. Like, I don't think he's going anywhere. I think he I think he stays in until death. I mean, he's not far from death, he's old, but uh Germany had great tech, but not the industrial power. We won with Sherman tanks, B-17s, and our industrial power. Liberty ships were built in two weeks. I think we'd have a hard time winning. Yeah, yeah. German German technology was so far superior to ours during World War II. Like you you go back and you watch that movie with the tank.
SPEAKER_04:Yes and no. I mean, they definitely got they definitely got there, but at the same time, like as impressive as the Blitzkrieg was, once you got past that initial thrust of tanks, their army was horse-born still for the most part, there logistically, anyways.
SPEAKER_02:But but yeah, I well, they were also spread throughout throughout the Soviet Union, also. Like, if they maybe if they didn't try to fight a war on two fronts, it might have been different. But yeah, they they they also blitzkrieg people who weren't uh prepared for it in any way whatsoever. They would just go in and then just take over everything.
SPEAKER_04:It wasn't oh they no, that's not true. I mean, France was prepared, they had the Maginot line, like uh the problem was France was prepared for World War One again, and Germany went around just went around it. But um uh while we're while I'm thinking about it, we have a$50 super chat from last show we need to talk about.
SPEAKER_02:So, okay, yeah. So this is from uh house music that we forgot to highlight last time. This is actually from my friend Patrick. Uh oh, it was from Patrick, yeah, it's from little Patrick, and we forgot to read it last time.
SPEAKER_04:Wow, you are such an a-hole.
SPEAKER_02:That was on one of my 10-minute rants that you were ignoring. You didn't bring up the super chat for me. Uh, but Patrick said, we talk about accelerationism in the church, piggybacking to 2028. Is it morally justifiable to either vote Newsom over Vance or just not vote for Vance so Newsom can win, so we can revolution and then Gruper Christian nationalism? So he's basically saying, like, and I actually understand this. People people have been bringing up. I watched it uh a clip from the Catholic Family podcast the other day where they were like, if anybody that could say it would be better if Kamala Harris won, you know, that's insane. And look, there are a lot of things that have changed under Trump that we kind of take for granted. The the woke stuff is dead, like really is dead, right? Like, we're not we're not talking about men and women's sports anymore and stuff like that.
SPEAKER_04:I used to never mind, never mind.
SPEAKER_02:Never mind like things have gotten a little bit back to normal, but I I've always thought that that was kind of a false flag, and like it was so preposterous that just getting rid of that makes people think Trump did so much.
SPEAKER_03:Um uh oh man, I gotta deal with this. Well, I gotta deal with a work, a work thing. Um you gotta you gonna have to talk for a second.
SPEAKER_04:Oh boy.
SPEAKER_02:Um I've all I've always thought that um wait, where was I just talking? See, he tells me to talk, I start to talk. He just talks right around.
SPEAKER_01:I was trying to help you until you quite came up with something. All right, just give me one second, I just gotta text somebody.
SPEAKER_04:Oh wow, you're the worst.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, half a second.
SPEAKER_04:Wine break, everyone. Go get yourself some requisite and sellers wine. Uh we um we are working on a deal with Fat Thins. So it sounds like Fat Thins will be sponsoring at least a couple episodes. And uh legitimately they they really are the best chips. Um do we remember do we remember how bad the censorship was before Trump? If Kamala got in, it would have become yeah, yeah, yes, yes.
SPEAKER_02:I will admit that. But here's what I'll say because that uh to get back to Patrick's question. So, yes, that is absolutely true. Like censorship and and the conversation, like we used to have to be so careful what we talked about on YouTube. We got Twitter back, like Twitter feels like the Wild West again, all those things are awesome. But there's another element of when Biden was in, we had an enemy to fight, and people were more aware what so if Biden did some of the things that Trump is doing, people would lose their minds because it was Biden. But because it's Trump doing them, you kind of get the MAGA crowd just going, the MAGA crowd just going rah-rah Trump. So, like the very same things they would be furious. I saw Trump announce central bank digital currency the other day, essentially. Like he didn't he was he was basically like, we're gonna revolutionize the money, the way money is is is is done. We're gonna have you know, we're gonna have uh uh cryptocurrencies and this and that. He basically is pushing for central bank digital currency, but because it's Trump doing it, these people are going to go along with it. It's like it's it's it's like the fact that the left hates Trump so much makes the right just go along with things because they have this dialectic in their mind. It's like if the left hates it, it must be good. It's it's it's what is wrong with Republican, Democrat, like the the way the dialectic is in our in our in our country and in just the way we we structure things, right? So you think like can you vote for the lesser of two evils? Like you're playing into their system. American reform actually had a really good tweet on this, man.
SPEAKER_04:I I truly, honestly hope that before the end of my life, I will not have to worry about voting every four years.
SPEAKER_02:I I don't I don't think I I this is a bold prediction, but I just don't I don't think Trump is going anywhere. Like I don't I think in 2028, like I don't think I don't think we have a an election with Vance. Like I think I think Trump is staying somehow or another.
SPEAKER_04:So I was I would ask you how I don't know.
SPEAKER_02:I think they'll they'll find a way to like make it like it's legal, but I just see what he's doing, man. Like maybe there'll be the war and it'll be executive powers and they'll have to suspend the elections like they did over in Ukraine. That's possible. Like, I don't know, I just don't see him going anywhere, man. That's what I know it's a crazy thing to say, and I'm not like I'm not like staking my life on it or anything. I just just the things he's doing.
SPEAKER_04:I'm just like this guy So what I could see is um is something uh very similar to what they would often do in the Roman Republic, right? You always had um you had two consuls, always, right? And they served uh oh majoring is gonna rip me if I don't get this right. Um I think they served a year apiece, right? The cons the two consuls. But what often happened is they would um when a consul was done serving, you know, one of his supporters would would get in to the consulship after him and put him in uh you know another high office or governorship. Um, but once you were in that upper layer of of power and influence in the the Roman Republic, you always stayed in that upper layer basically until you were died or were murdered or you know, something. So I I would not be surprised if, say, Vance, you know, is elected consul, you know, president, but that Trump is in probably not a cabinet position, but you know, as some sort of special advisor, whether you know who's really who's really because I we would say right now Trump probably isn't really pulling all the strings, right?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I don't think so. I don't think I don't I think he he's I don't know man, I don't know what's going on with them, but I thought the dictators were six months at most.
SPEAKER_04:I could I'm yeah, not sure.
SPEAKER_02:So uh how does the how does the Roman Republic who is it? Uh it uh is it a is it Augustus? Augustus the first emperor?
SPEAKER_04:Like at the end of the day, Augustus is considered the first emperor, yes.
SPEAKER_02:First emperor. Um all right, let's read the super chat. Uh what what is most hated hated? What is most hated world war movie that you guys cannot stand? And has time changed your perspective on these movies? How do you think your perspective on World War One and World War II has changed in the last five five to twenty oh man? That's a good question. Um uh any any so like I still like band of brothers because band of brothers doesn't focus on the Holocaust at all until right.
SPEAKER_04:There's one episode where they liberate a work camp, not an extermination camp, because those, anyways. Um Band of Brothers is a story about the relationship between the men, yeah, right. And and saving private Ryan is similar. Honestly, all your your very good war stories are usually about the relationship between the men involved.
SPEAKER_02:Um yeah, and when and men, men, you know, when you're when you're for when a relationship is formed in battle like that, like you it's a deeper brotherhood than blood, you know. So it's like those movies, you know, it's like you hear those soldiers at the beginning of each episode of say of uh band of brothers, and it's like man, it's okay to cry on those. You're allowed to use one of your cries.
SPEAKER_04:Is Enemy at the gates is the uh sniper one on the wet the Eastern Front, right? That's a case. Yeah, I'm not a fan of that one.
SPEAKER_02:Um, the really it's the the ones that focus heavy on the Holocaust now. I just see as propaganda because I view the Holocaust completely differently than I used to, and and over the past five to fifteen years, I would say really my my view on this started to shift in 2020 during COVID, is when I really even started thinking about this stuff. But it was the conversations on this channel, and and me and Rob, like early on, I remember um like we were always like a little hesitant about the the Jake.
SPEAKER_04:Were you like we do need to call it the Holly from now on?
SPEAKER_02:The Holly, yeah, yeah, yeah. The Holly. Um, we were always like, I don't know, there's something, you know, but we didn't we never did like deep dives in it, but then the conversations we've had on this channel, and then seeing how things have unfolded. That episode I mentioned earlier where I talk about um uh the the hostile takeover of the Catholic Church. That's the episode where we discussed Trent Horn at the Phylos Project. Yeah. So that's like the first episode where we're just like, you know what, we're talking about this. And it was it was really I thought it was like two years ago. It was this year, man. It was like 2025, it was March of 2025 when we really started getting into it. That's when we really no, we had conversations with Father Mods like years back, yeah. Um, but they they they really just the when when we started uh really getting into it, it was really in the past two years, I would say. Where where we I think both of our positions has completely shifted, and then I started looking at it from a biblical perspective, and seeing them meddling in the the the workings of all the formerly Christian nations, I can't not see that as the whore drunk on the blood of the martyrs, which I've said a thousand times on this show. It's just that's what it comes, that's what it comes off as to me. So, I mean, I kind of can't not like I look at everything through that perspective, which is probably not good all the time. Like it was hard for me to not see Venezuela through that lens, you know, like my initial instinct is why is Trump doing this for Israel? That was my first initial instinct. And it took it took like me like taking those blinders or that those those uh glasses all, like seeing it through that lens to go, all right, maybe this is something different here, and and then having the conversation about what happens with Europe. Like, I don't know what happens with Europe in this situation, and then if if what happens with Europe, what happens with Canada? So, like Greenland is actually important, right? Because what happens with Canada? Because Canada is loyal subjects of the king. So if Europe breaks apart, you know what I mean. Yeah, like they got the king on their money and stuff, like and and and Canada is our neighbor. Like, do we just basically say you know, you guys got no choice, you're coming with us? Like, can they put up much resistance to that? I don't know. I'm do we invade Canada, like, do we? I don't I don't know. Like, can they it can't go worse than the last time we tried? Like, can they can they get can they step out of line? Like, I don't even know if they can. Can they? I don't think they can step out of line.
SPEAKER_01:I think they gotta do what we say, right?
SPEAKER_02:It's Canada, like they gotta do what we say, right?
SPEAKER_04:As long as we don't let them vote.
SPEAKER_02:Not that I want to know, but but even like I remember when Kennedy and uh and those guys were like the Canadians were all getting mad at what Trump was doing. I agree with the set A for once. Just a humble opinion, Europe falling under Islam may be their chastisement, not another world war. It would be yeah, I a hundred percent. Like, I mean, we've been talking about that for like the Islam has always been a chastisement against Christianity, and and Europe, like you cannot separate Europe from the church, like the church European history is church history, they are one and the same. If you if you want to understand European history, it is shaped by the Catholic Church and then the Reformation, like that is European history, and you're looking at a continent that abandoned its God, and there's no way they're not due for that's why I don't I don't know if we deal with the chastisement the same way Europe does, because we were never Catholic, we were never a Catholic nation, so it's not really like we abandoned the Catholic Church. If anything, we've done work to evangelize the Protestant nation to Catholicism in some aspects. Um, we also, though, for the most part, most Catholics that you see even at church, like we are in such a minority, guys. Like this audience, you guys watching right now, we are in such a minority of people who pay attention to things happening in the church and that we care about the church. Wait, does that make the Mormons the US chastisement? No, I think Islam is still the US chastisement. It's just, I don't think we we uh because the US is so big, and there's so many places to escape them because they are, I think, 0.8 percent of the population. I mean, they're they're very concentrated in cities and stuff, but they don't stand a chance against us. I I worry more about a race war in America, uh, just all minorities, you know, kind of grouping together, and even if they're not all fighting, they're all they're seeing and seeing each other as the end of the thing.
SPEAKER_04:I can promise you, blacks and Asians are never grouping together against the no, the Asians will go on the white side, I think. Yes, 100%.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, the Asians will go on the white side. The um, but you're getting into Kibajo stuff, right? Like Our Lady of Kibaho, you were talking about these two tribes, you have the Hutu's and the Tutsies. These are people that our lady was warning them, just the way they were talking about one another. It's like we're looking at that same situation in America where we're talking about the left this way and the left. Like you're going to have you're going to have conflict in the US. We talked about that last episode, but I I just think all of this stuff is is culminating in some stuff. I can't believe how many super chats are getting this episode. You guys are so cheap, usually. This is amazing. Anthony's got instinct on where we are in history is on point, even if his analysis is messy sometimes. I work in AI, and even tech alone is a paradigm change. Too many convergence points, right? I I like I that that's a very fair critique. Like, my points are messy sometimes, right? But because I'm all over the place. I don't I don't know what do you guys want from me? I'm not I'm not like a learned man like Joshua Charles. What can I tell you?
SPEAKER_04:He called me the called me the other day, and uh, oh Josh has actually called me to talk to me instead of just Anthony. And then I realized he was just calling all the donors for end of year. I thought he was asking for tech advice. Everybody, oh everybody. Oh, you want to know what funny? At the end, he's like, you know, we're gonna be trying some different things. So do you mind if I give you a call and uh to ask about some tech advice?
SPEAKER_02:Oh man, feel free, dude. I'll get texts all the time, like Taylor Mushroom be like, Hey, can you give me Rob's number? I gotta ask him something that'll just go Rob from anybody, everybody's thinking about it.
SPEAKER_04:Come on, no, that that's Anthony. I get called to ask how they fixed the computer.
SPEAKER_02:Rob, we both have our role to play. Come on. Oh, I don't know, man. Honestly, but even um the conversations we've had on this channel over the years, man, it's like something works about the dynamic between us, right? We're so drastically different. We both see things from a very different perspective. But even when we disagree, as long as we're not texting, it works fine. If we're texting or tweeting, texting and tweeting doesn't go well, but anytime we have a face-to-face conversation, we're able to like, okay, all right, yeah, all right. I see it from your point of view.
SPEAKER_04:But first, it called us stupid, now he called us cheap. Well, you're also all uh masochists, so apparently you enjoy it.
SPEAKER_02:Look, you guys get on my case an awful lot. I'm gonna I'm gonna say it to you every once in a while, too. Uh, people monarchists enjoy it. I don't know, man.
SPEAKER_04:Okay, but that's 2022, 2023, 2022.
SPEAKER_02:I'm trying to pick up some new catchphrases because I used the what what were some of the other ones? Remember, we had the list, you had the list of um yours was to be fair. You gotta understand, you gotta understand. Oh man, it's uh I'll tell you, Rob. Like the the main reason that all this stuff really sucks is because where we've come on this show, like my life has never been in a better place. Like uh this this show has provided a little bit of financial stability in my life. Like, I like I remember I remember the years of living paycheck to paycheck.
SPEAKER_04:They're supposed to still think we're not making money, remember?
SPEAKER_02:I mean, we we don't make a lot, but I mean it's it's it's enough that it's provided financial stability in my life, right?
SPEAKER_04:It's like it's it has it honestly, guys. It it has helped, and we are incredibly appreciated, incredibly grateful, man. It's not to be gay, like no homelow here, but yeah.
SPEAKER_02:No, it's it's provided financial stability in my life where it's like if something comes up, I'm not like, oh my gosh, I gotta drain my savings for it, or things like that. Like it's been it's it's been a blessing beyond that. Like, I am going to see Europe because of the the opportunities this show has provided me. Like, God has give has been so good to me. And it's like, oh man, this whole thing's gonna fall apart soon. It's very scary for me, I'm telling you. Like, that's kind of why like people think like I think I do money this stuff all the time because I live in New York or something, and that's why I'm like it's like no, like life is really good, man. My family. An amazing place right now. My my uh still no man on this I love our audience. Those they've been with those that have been with us forever, you guys are loyal, but they also don't ever forget a single let me live anything down. Um he thinks I actually just put ketchup on my hot dogs because he he doesn't get my my food trolls that I like steak sauce. I know we like to put it on a hot dog sauce. I put I put ketchup and mustard on. I like ketchup and a little onion, ketchup, mustard. Uh the um, yeah, no, it's just this this whole journey we've been on, man. It's been it's been really fun to even have a place to like have an outlet to say some of these because I have the I've had these kinds of like grand um theories for a very long time, and I finally have a place to to to talk about my grand theory because nobody else wants to hear them.
SPEAKER_04:You guys are like really Anthony has always been very open since the very beginning that this was his therapy, yeah, yeah, for sure.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it's a it's like an outlet. Like if you're having a bad day, you could come on and flip out on your son in the green room and then come on and tell everybody about it. It's like that's kind of what we do here. So awkward. But um, we do want to discuss. Uh, we're gonna go over to the other side now. We're on here for an hour and 20. Uh, this is a different kind of show, man. Just kind of exploring some of the some of the the situations in the world right now from it from a bit of a different perspective. But um I want to discuss the ortho bros on the other side. Um, and uh we survived the co-sleeping scandal, we can now survive anything. Um, I want to discuss ortho bros, and Rob has a uh a position on them also that like they kind of become a fifth column if we go to war with Russia, right?
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, yeah. All your uh your based Rokor orthobro Chads are suddenly uh potential Russian agents if uh if things go down. So they should be treated as such.
SPEAKER_02:We'll get into them on the other side, and we'll see where else the conversation goes. Uh, we went from horses to the moon in a hundred and on uh in a hundred years, now AI, tech grows exponentially, not linearly. We either end soon or God knocks us down and not that's what we could talk about over there, too, because the um you you have that's that gets into some of the stuff we talked with Hitchborne about. Like, why does God flood the world in the first place? So we'll do that on the other side. We're gonna talk Ortho Bros, God flooding the world with fire this next coming time, and how we'll uh I don't know. We'll just we we like to just we don't even have a plan usually for locals, and the local shows tend to be the best. That's all I know. Like almost every time we always actually do save the better topic for locals.
SPEAKER_04:I think we just both for whatever reason feel more free. So whatever topic it is just ends up becoming better.
SPEAKER_02:You just kind of just hanging out, yeah. Like on YouTube, you feel like you have to present yeah something, right? Like you feel like you have to like give something to get clicks and views. Like, we don't have to worry about views on locals, so we're kind of just like, I don't know, we'll read the chat, we'll see what's going on over there. Who cares? So, uh, if you guys can't afford locals, go check out Latin Slavs.
SPEAKER_04:And if you do come to locals, hit them up after.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, we love Latin Slavs, even though they don't invite us on anymore. Uh, and also uh I've never been on once again, never been on with them. What's Caleb's channel? I want to shout out a new crusade. He's had me on twice, thankfully. Yeah, yeah. Caleb's awesome too. I Latin Slavs and Caleb are my my two. Um Chris is still on probation. I'm not gonna promote him. He's got to do six months because he's had another e-girl on. Um six months probation, six months probation.
SPEAKER_04:If you can Jason and Mark don't have a channel anymore, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:We can't promote them anymore. But uh, so it's really it's like it's it's Latin Slavs and a new crusade. Those are those are our guys, man. Those are our guys. I don't know.
SPEAKER_04:They they are the uh did you see the article Caleb came up with today? Uh excusing us from ever having words suits again. It's good anytime, Joe Joey. Just reach out to me on Twitter or something like that.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, well, like Rob and I are pretty like we we we'll go on, you know. I mean, in in uh I will be on with Joshua Charles next Wednesday, uh, for his first time inviting me on his channel.
SPEAKER_04:He did warn me about that and said it was no hard feelings towards me after he thanked me for giving the money every month and then told me he only wanted to talk to me for tech help.
SPEAKER_02:So well, I have been like ruthless to Josh because he has not had me on yet, and you're not anything nearly as annoying as I am, so that might have something to do with it. But yes, Joe McLean. Joe McLean is uh uh Joe McLean's awesome. I call into Joe. If you guys um just found our channel, that's amazing. I didn't think people new people are still coming across us. Joe McClain's show. Uh, I call into regularly. Rob doesn't even promote guns and rosaries.
SPEAKER_01:Adrian, you want to come hang on locals? Bring Adrian on locals.
SPEAKER_04:Adrian, I mean, Adrian, you got the login, bud.
SPEAKER_02:Just come on. Come come hang on locals, Adrian. Come hang. We'll talk. I want to I want to talk to both of you guys. I want to uh see if we can set something up for you guys. Maybe I'll get an invite to that.
SPEAKER_04:Um, how did how did you find the channel? That's what I'm that's a good question. How did you find our channel? And this uh, when will we talk about lofton again? Whenever he says something stupid again.
SPEAKER_02:Nah, I'll tell you, probably not. I actually haven't thought of him in like a long time. I actually came across one of his streams the other day. He was like, he's actually uh like being very critical of the Vatican. That's kind of strange. I'm like, what is this? What is even going on there? I don't know. So um, all right, we are going to head over to locals. If you guys like this side of the show, you'll like locals way better. That's all I can tell you. Come to locals where everybody is welcome. All are welcome at locals for a price.
SPEAKER_04:It just popped up randomly on YouTube. Wow. Cool. Which I which episode? I'm curious. And what made you click? And yeah, we are on Rumble. We prefer you watch on YouTube, but you can watch on Rumble if you really want.
SPEAKER_01:All right, take us out. Let's go.
SPEAKER_04:Hold on, hold on. We we gotta actually tell people where to go for locals. Uh avoiding Babylon slash locals or something. What is it? Oh, it's on the screen, and you can't even get it.
SPEAKER_02:No, I was I I actually pulled my screen off to pull up the locals chat. That's why.
SPEAKER_04:Uh avoidingbabylon.locals.com. The link to the direct show is pinned in the live chat as of right now.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, this one we I I always like when our shows kind of like go out with a whimper.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, you definitely never give me crap for that. It's just first time viewing live for packs here.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, Italy. Yeah, if you guys didn't see the beginning of the show and you want to come to Italy, go check the beginning of the show out because we got way more people in the chat now than we did. If you watch the beginning of the show, I gave the Italy pitch. And I'm probably not going to do that. I might like to do a quick mention of it, but I'm not going to give that big pitch again. So if you want to hear the details on Italy, go watch the first five minutes of the show. I give the I give the pitch.
SPEAKER_04:And um you can email him at Anthony at avoidingbabylon.com.
SPEAKER_02:Fed, can I read the DM you sent me? Can I read the DM you sent me? Because I would like to, I would really like to read that. And my Catholic audience would love to hear that. And I'd like to do it on YouTube before we leave. Uh, but that's up to Fed. Okay, you guys so um Fed is a pr uh Protestant and he's been uh he's been enjoying our show. Like I think he just started watching because he thought we were kind of entertaining, and um he's been introduced to topics that he that he's um that he you know he was probably a little hostile towards before, but uh he sent me a DM and he said, Hey bro, how are you? I caught the show an hour late last night because I was having a conversation with my kids about Mary. I was explaining to them how I discovered typological hermeneutics and how we as Protestants view doctrine and the Bible through perspective lens, a prescriptive text, only hermeneutics for the major doctrines, and by and large reject typological hermeneutics, with a few exceptions. We discussed where her title as Queen of Heaven originates from Revelation Revelation 12 to the concept of the Davidic Queen Mother and other patterns. Catholicism didn't just invent the title or the view of Mary as queen or royalty, but rather follow a pattern for consistent interpretation. We also discussed her as our motherly adopt as our mother by adoption. We were contrasting both theological framework and how not understanding the hermeneutics is at the root of our misunderstanding of Catholic theology. I was explaining how when we ask, show me book and chapter and verse for that, what we're actually asking for is the prescriptive and not typology text as evidence. Anyhow, we concluded there's nothing biblically wrong with saying Mary is the queen of heaven and our mother by adoption and the mother of God. If anything, we don't give her enough credit for she is and what she for what for who she is and what she's done. It's strange for us as pros to think that to think that or even to say it, but it's because we've learned we've never actually learned it. You introduced me to typology and to folks who explain it really well. I need to revisit some of that material, but bro, I feel like a new world has opened up to me. Thank you. Happy Wednesday. Like I'm fed, I love you, brother. You got like six months left, dude.
SPEAKER_04:You're you will be registered in RCIA this fall.
SPEAKER_02:You're gonna you're gonna cling to I don't have to become Catholic, dude. I don't have to become and it's gonna be like a cliff drop something to go.
SPEAKER_04:When when it's happening, let us know, and we'll get you connected with air our friend Aaron, yeah, who was a Protestant pastor, or we can get you connected with Keith or any number of other former Protestants. So just let us know when it starts happening.
SPEAKER_02:So it's it really is actually a beautiful um because I've I've been friends with Fed for a while now, and he we always share things with each other, but he really does enjoy our biblical episodes, and um for those of you listening on audio only, Father James Martin has been popping in the pretty hilarious comments.
SPEAKER_04:He just said connect uh connect him with me.
SPEAKER_02:Um, but uh fed is uh he's just uh he's he's always he's always had an open heart and always been willing to ask questions, and uh, I think that's all it really takes, right? Once once somebody softens their heart to the possibility of the Catholic faith, it's kind of like okay, well, if they weren't wrong on this, what else are they not wrong on? And eventually it gets to the point where you're just like it's the pearl of great price, man. I have to receive the Eucharist. Yeah, so pray for Fed. We're gonna we're gonna head out.
SPEAKER_04:Well, well, while we're at it, if you if you all could could do me a favor and um pray for a Twitter mutual uh Supreme Crusader who just passed away. He was um he was also a Protestant who I I really thought one day was gonna make that swim across the Tiber.
SPEAKER_02:And um yeah, Fed, take that, take that as food for thought, right? Like like Supreme Crusader is 40 years old, he had uh had some underlying health conditions, and um you know memento mori, man.
SPEAKER_04:Like we we all think we're gonna live forever, but you never know when when like to anyone if if if you're if you're not a catholic and ever get to the point where you are convinced it's true, but you want to wait or or don't feel ready or whatever, you don't you don't know when your last day is. None of us come down with something like the flu, and next thing you know, you're gone, man.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and living a sacramental life has changed my life. Like, because at the time I was away from the sacraments to now, yeah, it's life-changing. So all right, thank you guys for joining us on on YouTube. We are going over to the after show.
SPEAKER_04:Please do uh we go live usually every Tuesday and Thursday. Where it varies at times, but usually every Tuesday and Thursday.
SPEAKER_02:It's it's pretty, it's a pretty firm schedule. We do Tuesdays and Thursday nights at 8 p.m. Eastern. So like every once in a while something will come up and we'll change it up a little bit. But that is our regular schedule. Tuesday night, Thursday night, 8 p.m. Eastern. Uh, pleasure to have you on the show, broski bear. And we'll uh we'll see you soon, hopefully.
SPEAKER_04:So we're going over to locals now.
SPEAKER_01:What are they thinking we left with them?
SPEAKER_02:Um, yeah, dude, uh man. Cleveland Antiquity had me on a show the other day. And like I I like I I tried to just have like a um like a good conversation, like just a nice conversation with the guy, but man, is it's like when you watch a Protestant become Catholic, what you see is someone typically I'm sure there are some obnoxious ones, but for the most part they fall in love with the church, they fall in love with the faith, and they and they're just like excited to talk about Catholicism. But Cleeseware Antiquity, like he basically was just like Protestant, hated Catholicism, and he's like now he's Orthodox and just hates Catholicism. It's like all of these guys, it's the same thing with Set of Acantists, man. It's like they're obsessed with Catholicism. Like it, it's like, and I know cat, I know Seties are Catholic, don't that's not what I mean.
SPEAKER_04:I mean, like they're obsessed with proving their their minutia, you know, they're not trying to convert people to their church, they're trying to deconvert Catholics, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And it's and it's all about getting this guy on my team. Like it's dude, that is so Protestant, man. It's like it's one of the things I don't like about when Protestant converts come in and do it. Like, it's like I don't I may like troll Protestants, but I don't argue with them about theology and stuff, like it's just dumb. Like, I don't, especially the ones who are hard of heart. Like I don't care if they're on my team. Like, if you if you want to be that stubborn, don't come on my team. Like, I don't care.
SPEAKER_04:So this could have been the only entertaining show on Pelican Plus. At least I waited for the locals this time.
SPEAKER_02:Um, what's going on over there? Are they are they doing good? No, I have no idea.
SPEAKER_04:I don't see their content anymore.
SPEAKER_02:I don't yeah, it's like even their main guys don't promote it. It's like like Kennedy should be tweeting about stuff every day, posting clips of his show. It's like not all I see from Kennedy is him always going after Zoomers, like the Fuentes guys, but like man, it this was why I was worried about going there, though, is because I didn't see any plan for and I didn't want to make this show about them. Well, you let's stick with the with the with the ortho stuff. Um, the the there's this like because the only orthodox guys I've ever enjoyed were Peugeot and um like one or two of the priests, uh like the Lord of Spirits guys, and it's because they don't talk about Catholicism, they just like they they talk about some of the cool things and beautiful things in Orthodoxy. Peugeot's talking about symbolism, but they're not like I need you on my team. Oh, I have to I have to own the Catholic. It's just so cringe. Like Cleaves Antiquity has not he's not even Orthodox yet. He's he decided four months ago he's going to become Orthodox, and he's acting like he's like the debate me bro of the Orthodox. Like, like like he's the guy that like he's good. I'm like, what what is this, dude? This is such a danger in being a professional he honestly should have gone on and be like, Oh, cool, how long you've been Orthodox?
SPEAKER_04:Oh, you're not Orthodox. I did.
SPEAKER_02:I didn't, I didn't I thought he was you should have been like, sorry, I thought I was coming on with someone who was actually Orthodox, and then just I didn't know he was a catechumen still, like he's four months Orthodox, uh four months into deciding he'll be Orthodox, and all all he's doing is like knocking Catholics down. I'm like, What are you like? What is this?
SPEAKER_04:It's dude, it's so annoying, and even like if someone was named Wretched Saints and decided to become Catholic and then became a Catholic apologist before becoming Catholic and then got caught up in a sex scandal along with another Catholic apologist.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I'm not gonna accuse Cleves of doing any of that stuff. No, I know it is it is the dangers of like being a professional influencer, and then you do like for him, like now he's like it's just so weird, dude. It's the same thing with like the set of a contest to in this aspect. Like I like Gregory, uh, the guy that runs the St. Anthony Padua sede account. Like, I generally like him, he's not he's not an a-hole or anything. And like he came on my feed today arguing with me about the hierarchy, and I'm like, I'm like, dude, I've heard all of these arguments before, like, I don't find them convincing. You're not smarter than the other hundred sets that have said the exact same thing. Like it's it's like the the arguments you guys are putting forth. I've heard them, they're not convincing to me. It's a cute theory, and and it's like I I like I am I even say like there's a possibility it's correct, but your theories are not convincing me. You want to know what would convince me? Like the only argument that would convince me is sanctity, and I don't see it, I don't see it. Like, I see or a miracle, a miracle or sanctity produce a miracle, it's it's just something totally lacking, and I'm not even talking about the online settings. Like, I want to like show me the show me the set of acontist saints, like uh let me see one, let me see the Saint Francis of set of acontism. I don't know, he doesn't need to be canonized, but show him to me, and I and that's a convincing argument. Like the the ortho bro, debate me bro thing, and like going at the Joe Heshmeyer, and he's like, It's like, dude, Joe Heshmeier is not he's not 30 years old, like the guy, he's an older guy, and like he's looking at how the last debate went down with Elijah Elijah. Oh, yeah, but I'm saying he's not he's not like he's not like a a zoomer, right? Like, in you know what I mean. And he he's watching the the crap that happened after the Elijah Yazi debate, and he's like, I don't know, this isn't this nonsense. Like it he's like, it's just immature, like it's not that he's afraid to debate the guy. It's like this is just the the shit you guys are doing on Twitter is just obnoxious, and it's like the the oh the the What does he say? Uh Catholic content is making me lose my head. It's like, dude, you're not even Orthodox yet. Like, settle in, become Orthodox. Talk about why you became Orthodox. Like, talk about like you would think a guy like that would like find like it's the same thing with Joseph, Joseph Chambra. Joseph Chambra left Catholicism and he goes to become Orthodox and he spirals worse. Like if you didn't find peace there, clearly, you didn't find peace there. You're still obsessed with the Catholic Church. Like, if that was the true church, you would go there and you would find peace there, and you wouldn't care what the Catholic Church is. I don't care what Protestants are doing, I don't care what the Orthodox are doing. Like, I don't care. I don't think about you guys. We are the main character. I don't know what to tell you guys.
SPEAKER_04:And all they do is continue to prove that dime after dime after time.
SPEAKER_02:We are the main character. I'm sorry that you guys have little brother syndrome or whatever the hell it is you have. Nobody cares about orthodoxy. They think there's like this this flood of orthodox converts. No, there's not. There's not a flood of orthodox converts. There's a few, there's a there's a few, and they're influencers and stuff. Like most of the converts that are coming in, they're J Dyer converts, and that's a problem because they're not actually like none of them are like becoming saints. Like, you know what I mean? Like if you wanted to actually convey all the other Orthodox literally call them diorites, yeah. They don't that their own hierarchy is condemning them, and it's like the the idea that the Orthodox Church is the true church, it's like which one? Which one? What do you mean? None of you agree on anything, and as soon as you disagree with a bishop, you leave anyway. It's like, oh no, no, that guy's there's not it's nonsense. It's like because I was on his show and people and I was like talking about certain things, and people are like, Anthony's like 70% of the way being coming becoming orthodox, like no, like it is the dumb, like no, I'm not never ever would I ever be tempted to orthodoxy. It's silly to me, it's a cute theory, guys. It's a cute theory, but every one of you make your own decision. It's why, like, look, I can talk about because I went on um uh Catholic Catholics for Rednecks interviewed me yesterday, and it was a really good interview. Um and he's a convert, and he started off. He was a uh a he was like a uh a like a Pope Respector. What do we call that guy? Uh uh Pope splainer? A Pope Spleener. It's funny, they've died, they've we forget what we call them because they don't matter anymore, they don't matter anymore, yeah. Yeah, so so he was he was a Pope spleener, he converts and he and he falls in love with the Catholic Church, and like he doesn't want to believe like the stuff that he's hearing, right?
SPEAKER_04:I mean, he was a pope, he was a Pope spleener when we met him in person less than a year ago.
SPEAKER_02:So listen to this. So before we met him in person in North Carolina, a bunch of people that watch him found out we were gonna be speaking at the same conference, and they all warned him about how evil me and you were, and so he goes to that conference with this impression like we're the like we're we're evil. He thinks we're set of a contest, and we he thinks we're gonna lambast him.
SPEAKER_04:Well, that we happen to get canceled by the priest.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, that was a lot, there was a lot going on. There was a lot going on with that, right? So so he he's a he's a Pope Splaner and he goes to this event thinking we're going to like ridicule him because he goes to the Novus Ordo. And meanwhile, he meets us, and me and Rob were just really kind to him, like like we were just really kind to him. Best most funny talk there, funniest talk by far is like him and him and him and Fawaz had the two best talks of the night. Like, we were just super kind to him.
SPEAKER_04:Uh, his son meeting up gays in the 80s as a cop, yeah, dude.
SPEAKER_02:He was a cop in the 80s, they did a body cams. It was a hilarious story, man. So uh after the talks, we go back to the hotel and we're hanging out for a little bit, and him and his son go run and grab a bite to eat at McDonald's, and he's in the car with his son, and his son goes, Dad, you know, I know you think those guys will jump down your throat, but those two guys will die for you, like they'll die defending you. If, like, if they if you're their friend, like those two guys will go to they'll go to war for you, like those. And he said that conversation with his son changed his mind about us, right?
SPEAKER_04:Really, and and then he comes home and um by the way, his son is uh Catholicism on Instagram, got some really, really good funny memes and stuff.
SPEAKER_02:So he um he then uh sees the the pride event at the Vatican, yeah, and it kind of like shattered him, yeah, because he didn't want to believe it, and it kind of shattered him, right? And he's just been struggling with this ever since, like and and coming around to the fact that, like, man, all the stuff I thought about these guys who are a little critical of of Francis, and so and he just started asking me about that stuff, and uh and I was just like, Look, uh like I'm a cradle Catholic, right? And I've been kind of dealing with this for forever, you know. Like we've always had warn, yeah, we've always had scandals, we've always had the bishops who were not not faithful and stuff. And I kind of just took them through uh like a light version of my theory of the church being in her passion, you know, and how you know when Christ is on the pillar and when he's being crucified, like you'd never think that was the messiah. I was like, the church may not look like the church right now, but she's still the church, and we still have the promise of Christ. He got off that conversation with me and he texted me after, and he's like, Brother, I cannot tell you how much you did for my faith to just like like to help solidify my faith, you know. But it goes to show you that by Rob and I showing charity to him and being kind to him and not trying to tell him not to go to the novus ordo and not to like the things that he thought we would do, which is what these ortho bros are doing, which is what the set of accountists are doing. So Gregory comes in my timeline and he does all this stuff, and I wanted to just say to him, like, Greg, I like you. Like, I like you. Why are you trying to make me not like you? Like, what are you doing arguing with me about that? Like, I don't, I don't, you're not convincing me with this. All you're doing is making me think you're a dick. So, like, the P, especially somebody like me who I've had conversations on the phone with Greg, like he's he he donated to my brother's thing. Like, he's a I like him, right? Why not take a different approach with a guy like me who doesn't think the arguments are convincing and just show charity to a guy like me because you don't want because you don't need to cope with the decision you made. Like, I know I'm not coping with the decision I made. I know what I do, like I I I know what I am. I'm I'm I'm a Catholic and in and I'm and I like I'm in the church. I don't I know it's difficult at times, but I'm not leaving the bosom of the church, like I'm just not under any circumstance, like unless God gave me some clear sign from heaven to leave, and that hasn't happened.
SPEAKER_04:And I've asked my job is to make you make sure you always believe that God would never think you're important enough to do that. That's what I'm here for.
SPEAKER_02:I but I also do go into this subject with like as much humility as I can when I'm when I'm praying about it, and like God, if I'm wrong about anything, like open my heart to it. Like, I don't I don't I will go wherever you want me to go, I'll do whatever you want me to do, I'll say whatever you want me to say. I don't care. Like, if if you want me to go anywhere, I'll go there. But thus far, he the only thing God has pressed on my heart is that he wants me to help other Catholics who are struggling with the crisis to stay in the church. Like that's that's what I've felt pressed on my heart for this entire time we've been doing this. I've never gotten any any kind of any any any kind of uh revelation from God to do anything other than that. And that's what I will continue to do.
SPEAKER_04:I mean, we're we're not here to uh outside of the normal expectations of of Catholics, we're not here to teach anyone, we're not here to to bring people to the church, once again, outside of your normal obligations as Catholic to evangelize, but we're not here as apologists, as teachers, as honestly, as models of sanctity. I wish we were, obviously. We're we're just here to show you like you can be a normal guy and be Catholic and and talk about this stuff and not have to and we talk about this all the time. You don't have to pretend like you your catholic life is is perfect and keep it separated from all the crap that's going on in your normal life and in the world. You you it needs to all be one.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it really is that, right? Like it's it's if you like if you guys meet me in person, I am this guy. Like, I'm not a different guy, like I don't I don't ever put honing it down actually more than like this is who I am. If you meet me in person, I don't I'm not like acting for the show in any way whatsoever. Um so that it's like um so the priest that's coming said that to me. He goes, I was like, what like what made you start watching the show? He goes, I'm a priest, right? And I so and here's something about priests. Everyone, like when you're a priest, I've I've noticed everyone kind of treats you like differently because you're a priest, right? Like they just kind of treat you differently because you're a priest, and it's like which is good. I'm not I'm not saying that's wrong, but like sometimes like a priest needs a guy to shoot the shit with, you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_04:Like, he's a man, he just needs a guy to shoot the shit with, or even if you're not treating them differently, you are you put on an air almost when you interact with the bigger you want the priest to think you're holier than you are they are they are not getting um an authentic interaction with you. And I can't I imagine that makes it the loneliest damn thing in the entire world, dude.
SPEAKER_02:One of the things I'm looking forward to the most about going on this is to hang out with father and just like let him like just hang with him. Like he he priests, it is a lonely life because everybody kind of like puts up their guard around a priest, right? And like a like a priest just kind of needs to have a guy to hang out with and shoot the shit with and not feel like he has to put on any kind of an act or anything. What's up, Adrian? How are you, brother? What's up? It's a terrible angle. You better fix that.
SPEAKER_04:It looks like you're about to do duck face.
SPEAKER_06:Only chick to worry about angles.
SPEAKER_02:I was talking to Rob about this in the green room. Um, like, all right, so we're I'm going to Europe, but Rob's got four little kids, and he can't go to Europe, obviously. It's like it's just too much. But if you guys wanted to do something like on your land or something like that, like let and it like and just get a bunch of guys together, or maybe like fathers and sons, or you like plan something more oriented where like guys that have families can do, like, let's let's do something like that. You guys don't have to like you don't have to pay me or anything. I'll help you guys promote it. I'll come and hang out with you guys and stuff, but I think we do I would never pay you to hang out with me. I don't ever. I'm just saying, like I but I want you guys to be able to do something that you can put together and and something that's more geared towards families because there's so many people in our audience. Like, when we all those guys that came home, we did that um advice show, they were all like, Yeah, I got a couple kids, I just got married, and you know, like we need something for Jim Pine says he's skipping Italy with you to hang out with me. Kill him.
SPEAKER_06:Well, and I had talked to Rob about that. We're planning on doing like a little camp out probably in April. Um, just and it's you know, we're gonna do do some shooting, have some food, um, hopefully have a priest come by, you know, for for those days, offer some talks and stuff like that, you know, and it'd just be a good time at my my property down here. Uh, I'll feed y'all from the things I provide on my property here, you know, put pigs and steak and stuff, you know. We're just looking at things that because the whole purpose of our channel was to kind of start building that community of people to start leaning on each other, right? And um, it's grown a little bit, but um, you know, it's just we're we're against a a huge wall that has been there since the 60s that we just can't seem to do any more than chip away at it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Um Dave David's hang on one sec, because David, I think David sent us a message on Telegram. Um, he said, My buddies and I love your show. Are you planning on doing speaking? We can fly you out. So Rob and I actually talked about that this morning. We're we're gonna we're going to have to um figure something out with that because we both work and we have such little time that I I think like to get flown flown out for speaking gigs like that might be tough, but that's kind of why we're talking about what something like this, because this is something where can be planned ahead of time. Like we me and Rob have been kind of thinking about maybe doing like a a national park thing or something, like where something where people can bring their families, but like we we could all just hang by a campfire and and just talk and have a beer together and stuff. Because I mean, how much fun do we have in North Carolina just getting guys together and just talking and having a couple of beers and cigars, you know?
SPEAKER_06:Well, I think that like with guys like y'all who uh it's gotta be you've gotta be monetarily compensated for the time away from your family to come do a talk, right? Um, because you know, when I do when I do you know shooting classes, right? I have to make it worth my time that like this is time I could be finished me with my family instead, but I'm out here teaching you yokels how to shoot a gun, you know, um, which isn't a problem, but sometimes it's like I might need more life insurance because some of y'all shoot really badly. Um but uh you know, but that's why I've never argued with guys or even like saw an issue with this Catholic speaking circuit or whatever, because these people are taking time out of their lives to come do these things, they need to be compensated for it. Yeah, dude, time is is trading time and money.
SPEAKER_02:Time away from my family is valuable, and because I have so little of it, like if we just did this, that's one thing, like, yeah, sure, fly me out, but like I'm working five days a week doing this two nights a week, so I only have the Saturday and Sunday with my kids. Right.
SPEAKER_04:A weekend doing a speaking gig means that my kids hardly see me for two full weeks, two full, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:It is a it is a tough spot, Rob and Iron, because we work day jobs and we're like, we're not your typical Catholic influencer, you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_04:It's like and like like we said, like we don't feel that drive to to teach, you know, we're not apologists, like it's not our gig, so it has to be no.
SPEAKER_02:I think guys would just want to hang with us, right?
SPEAKER_04:I mean, I know I think guys would just want to hang out with us, and the thing is what I what I'm saying, you and I don't like get off on public speaking, like no, I hate it, dude.
SPEAKER_02:I dread it. Like, it's funny, like I have to go and like they're flying me to Tampa next weekend to do a speaking gig, and I'm dreading it. Like, for somebody who talks for a living, the idea of speaking before a group terrifies me. And I don't know if I should just go in, like, I don't even know what I'm talking about. I have to go next weekend, and I'm debating if I like I have a few different topics in mind, but no matter what I do, I think I'm just gonna wing it. Like, I'm not even gonna prepare anything. I think I'm just going to maybe go back and listen to one of one or two of our shows that I thought were really good, and I and and maybe try to put something together from that, and I'll just go give a talk on that. I mean, I'm talking to a bunch of uh older older Catholics, I think.
SPEAKER_04:I mean, I know what you I know what would make it interesting. Talk for that group.
SPEAKER_02:I know what would I do too. That's interesting. Like I like I so do I do I do the do I do the because they're an older says you could walk through how you patch a road. You could no, I mean the the I should do the JQ, right? Like I should take them through you. I should take them through the golden thread in in in in um in Genesis and take it like I should do through Romans 9 through 11 or that, right? So that's what I was thinking. I was like, maybe I'll just go back, I'll re-listen to those two shows we did during Advent, and I'll just try to summarize those into a half an hour. But like, because me and you were like kind of all over the place in some of those, but I think if I re-listen to them, I could probably summarize them into a coherent talk, but I'm gonna wing it, I'm not going to write it down.
SPEAKER_06:I'm just gonna go and just talk because you gotta go in with notes. You go in with notes of things you want to talk about, right? You can't write it down. Nothing I hate worse than going to a to a talk, and it's like this guy wrote it down, he's just reading it.
SPEAKER_02:He's just reading it on the back.
SPEAKER_06:But you're not gonna read this in an email, you didn't have to do this, but like have to like when I do speaking gigs, I do speaking gigs all the time um for work and all kinds of stuff. But I just have topics. I already know, like I there are topics I know, and I'm just all right, I'm gonna talk about this, right? When I'm done talking about that, I'm gonna move on. And sometimes I miss stuff, and then you know, if we have a question and answer session at the end, it'll get brought up then. But um, you're better when you just you have a topic and use yourself the cuff for a little bit.
SPEAKER_02:Uh so when I did the when I did the talk at the canceled priest conference, I wrote the whole thing out. And the best parts of that talk were when I went off script. Yeah, like the they were the best parts of the talk was when I like just put the paper down and I just because like I would read something and I was like, I was like, it made me think of something, and I just kind of went off script. Those are the best parts of the talk. Like when I talked about like my my uh son being my spiritual father because he told asked me to go to mass, I didn't write that down. Um he wasn't your spiritual father when you were yelling at him for that church. No, no, no, no, no, definitely not. But like those those were the parts of the talk that were actually the best, and they kind of saved the talk because if you just go up and read off a piece of paper, it's like you're doing a book report, you know. Nobody wants to like I'm considering going there and making fun of women for the first 10 minutes. Like, I'm very tempted to go there and just like make jokes about women and try to loosen these older older the older crowd up a little bit and see how they handle it. We all saw blood strike.
SPEAKER_04:Can get them killed this week.
SPEAKER_02:At least they talk about the holly. Um, this is off topic, but I just wanted to say that I have nursing care that comes to my home twice a week. Today a nurse came that I hadn't met before. She was a black woman with an African accent, so I asked her which country she was from. Turned out that she was Nigerian. Anyway, the conversation turned to Trump bombing the Muslims that have terrorized the Christians of Nigeria. She said that the Christians are so incredibly grateful to President Trump for that. What's your take on uh Trump, Adrian?
SPEAKER_06:That's a loaded question, man.
SPEAKER_02:You you have you have a nuanced, you have a nuanced take on him also?
SPEAKER_06:Um yeah, he's he's bringing the light a lot of things because he's a buffoon. Right? Like he doesn't he doesn't really understand what he's doing because he's being led by the nose, literally. And no, no, no, the nose is leading him. Oh yes, I said that backwards. Um and there he does good things, and then and then other times I'm like, well, he's just an old boomer. Like he just And of course he thinks that. Of course he, you know, doing all those business deals and construction deals in New York. Of course he, you know, he knows how to deal with the Jews. Right. And he knows that you gotta get involved with them to get certain things done. Um, but he's also the they I think they're playing to his pride a lot as well, which is why he's lineing away for everything. Yeah, exactly. But on the other side is he's put everyone in positions of power that the the left hates, which makes me like them even more. Right? Like Pete Heggs, I would have never ever he would have well so General Mattis before in the first administration, like he's a Marine Corps legend, right? Then that his administration as the the uh as the uh DOD secretary, um the defense secretary, that made me realize General Mattis is just another puppet, yeah. He's just like everybody else. So it kind of like you know, you they would say brings it to light unintentionally, right?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, you you start to you that Trump is like the great the great revealer, he was kind of like Francis. That's why I said it's a weird comparison, but Trump was very similar to Francis in that Francis Francis opened our eyes to the things that were actually going on before Francis, you know. Like I would have been a Pope splainer under Benedict and John Paul II, and then Francis comes along, and then you're like, All right, wait, maybe I should kind of look at these things that happened after Vatican II. If it wasn't for Francis, I'd have never done that, you know. So he was kind of like the the he was the great revealer in some weird way, and Trump did the same thing. You look you started looking at these institutions and these systems that were in place because they went haywire when he got in, and you're like, wait, if they're lying to me about that, what the hell else are they lying to me about?
SPEAKER_06:Well, it's funny because I went when we went to I went back up to Kentucky to get for Christmas. Um, we went up there because my daughter was getting a puppy, but I went and I was some of my family I haven't you know seen in a couple of years, and uh they're all boomers, you know, my whole dad's generation is up with boomers, but when I went and saw my godmother and was talking to her and all of her kids, you know, are a little bit younger than me, they're probably five years younger than me. I'm I'm in my mid-40s, and um, they're all very well read on the JQ. Yeah, and now my godmother is, so she's like talking to me about it and asking me about it. She's like, I can't believe they're they're involved in all this stuff. I didn't know they owned pornhood, right? I was like, so I'm like, okay, and like you know, I haven't talked to her in a couple years. I don't really know how to approach this subject with her yet. Like, I those doesn't want to, I don't want to drop anything on her yet. I'm like, I just want to kind of ease into the pool a little bit. But then a couple days later, I go see my godfather, and you know, um, and he kind of treats me like his son because my dad died like 12 years ago, so he's kind of taking me under his wing. But um, he's the same thing. He said, Do you know the Jews and this and this and this? And I was like, Man, my cousins must have been talking to you because they and they're all started, it's the kids who are gonna be the ones, just like it's the it's the boomers who were against homosexuals for so long, and all of a sudden they have a gay son, and they're like, I love the Jews. Um it's gonna be the opposite side with the Jews. The kids are gonna educate the the boomers and the Jews, and they're all like, I hate the Jews. And uh I don't know.
SPEAKER_02:I've been trying to break my dad for a while now. I'm not getting too far.
SPEAKER_06:You gotta find somebody that has more influence with them than you.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I my mom is awesome on it, on it. My mom is amazing on it. My mom like listens to all the all the episodes of Father Maudsley, and it's like my mom's great on it, but my mom has a spiritual perspective on it. My dad's like Fox News guy, you know what I mean? It's it's hard to break those Fox News guys out, yeah.
SPEAKER_06:It's it's that propaganda and that programming that we all went through. My wife's been asked, but my wife doesn't get involved in politics whatsoever.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, mine doesn't either.
SPEAKER_06:Um and she and and I'm glad about it. Um, but she's been, but then she's also still on like Facebook with some old friends, and so she sees things there, and we and she asked me about it, and she started asking about the Jewish question a couple weeks ago.
SPEAKER_02:Um, so I'm like, oh no, dude, I completely I completely rip build my wife on the case too. That's the only thing I talked to her about.
SPEAKER_06:I kind of hit her with the fire hose for about 30 minutes. Dude, my wife is so funny.
SPEAKER_04:I will I will say the word oven in a normal sentence, and my wife will chuckle now.
SPEAKER_02:I'm like, yes, dude, I'll say, like, uh anything that goes wrong now. My wife will go, it's it's the Jews, right? What have I done? Of course, what have I done to this woman? But yeah, no, like I liked I like that my wife doesn't pay attention to this stuff, but you're right, she'll see something on Instagram or something, and she'll be like, like with Venezuela, she's like, What's going on in Venezuela? I'm like, Nicole, I'm I'm not about to break down Venezuela to you. Like, it's just it's a three-hour conversation. I'm barely understanding it myself. Like, we're not having that. Just she's like, But is it good or bad? I'm like, how do you even answer that question? I don't like do you want to have a geopolitical conversation right now? Nicole, she's like, No, forget it, I don't care.
SPEAKER_06:It's like my wife will say a meme, and then she's like, What does this mean? And then I have to explain to her like six generations of memes to get to that one.
SPEAKER_02:You're just opening this can of worms.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, you get asked a question, it's like, okay, well, let's start with World War One and we'll go from there.
SPEAKER_06:It actually goes back further than that.
SPEAKER_02:We're gonna go to it is nuts how how many people are even open to having that kind of so, like, yeah, now should I so I think they kind of want me to talk about how to communicate with the youth. So, like, my the other topic I'm thinking of doing is um like how how to keep the trad movement together because I don't know what's going on with the trad movement anymore. Like, without Francis, it's lost, it's it's lost all yeah, that's it's kind of just there's no cohesion anymore. So, like I wouldn't even know how to put a talk together on that topic, but they want to know. I think I think they see me and they're like, Well, this guy is a trad and he's able to communicate with the younger audience. Like, what are we missing? Yeah, like what are we missing that maybe he can help us bridge that gap? Because I'm able to sit and have a conversation with a set of a contest, I'm able to sit and have a conversation with with Catholics for rednecks. It's just it's just a matter of being able to communicate with people that it comes down to. It's not, you know, it's it's not talking to your opponent in a condescending way like they're an idiot, and that's really what it comes down to. You just have to understand that whoever you're talking to believes what they're saying, and there's a reason they believe it, so don't don't disrespect their position and and try to work through a conversation respectfully.
SPEAKER_06:And I think that maybe what you have to talk about is talk about where Gen Z's coming from, right? And then what the issues they see, right? And the things they're having to deal with. Because you know, the trad movement, I don't think is that it's rudderless. I think people are just so burnt out and they just want to they just want to go to Mass on Sunday, man. Yeah, they just want to celebrate the the octaves and they just want to celebrate the holy days of obligation. Like, I'm burnt out.
SPEAKER_04:Sorry, Dr. K. I don't need to need I don't need to read another book. No, that is 90% of every other book you've ever read.
SPEAKER_02:Well, the biggest problem that that someone like Dr. K is facing is that when he was writing these books during the Francis era, we were all learning it for the first time, right? So it was exciting. It's like, oh man, like the the history of the Roman right. Like, I never knew this stuff. But the problem is, like, the bulk of the people that came in kind of went through that stuff. Like Taylor and Tim, when they started, they came in, and that stuff was all new to all of us, so their their show was blowing up because it was the first time we were talking about like novus ordo buzzwords, like felt banners and things like that. Like, and it would kind of like drop the veil of how corny the liturgy was. But it was the first time anybody ever spoke like that that wasn't like Michael Matt. Because I remember seeing Michael Matt videos and being confused when I was just a typical novice order Catholic. I would I would be confused, I didn't understand like why is he talking against the Pope? Like, it wasn't even a concept uh like a category, right? Well, because his audience was old, old, old treads, you know, from the because his family had been dealing with that since the beginning, whereas so then he got this whole influx of new people into the movement. Yeah, and that that influx is over now, like it's just over, and the younger guys don't care about Vatican II, they don't like they just don't care. You gotta talk about something different. Like Matt Gaspers came on the other night, and I love Matt, but Rob Rob said uh to me, he's like, Yeah, I don't know, those guys like the all they really know how to talk about is like Vatican II and liturgy and stuff, and like people don't really care about that.
SPEAKER_04:Like, it's just how many, how many guys literally ask them an opinion about other things, and they're like, Well, it's kind of like in Vatican II, it's like bro, no, and I and I don't want to Jasper's him in that show, he looked like a deer in headlights when you start talking about Venezuela, yeah.
SPEAKER_06:You know, he's yeah, he had no idea. And I'm sitting there in the gym and I'm working out listening to you all the next morning, and I'm watching it, and I'm just laughing because he's just like yeah, he didn't even well they can't relate it to booknini, they don't know what to do.
SPEAKER_02:The thing is that so that whole day, um, I like I didn't know where to go with that sh with that topic, and I was like, I need to understand this, and like I because I I try not to, I mean, I do always I do speak on things I'm not like obviously I don't know that much about, but I went into it with curiosity, trying to trying to grasp it the best I could with an open mind, saying, Don't just go into this with your typical way of thinking about it. So by doing that, I was kind of like I was listening to all sides of the arguments and then kind of working out those ideas with Rob on air, and that and that's helping me form a different opinion of like it I don't know, it it was a it was a fun show to do, man.
SPEAKER_06:There's and there's no problem working out your thoughts in real time, right? And it so I you know, I brought this up on our show the other night. Um, and it wasn't referring to you. I mean, it kind of was referring to you. I was kind of sub-quoting you in our show. Um, so but it's all these guys who have like Rob's losing it. All these guys have 50,000 followers or on whatever platform, and they think that they have to have a hot take about everything, right? Like, brother, you don't know any of the geopolitical ramifications of what's going on with this, and that's what was like the first 30 minutes of our show is like this is the reason like he said we're going after the oil, right? It's not because we're trying to make Exxon rich, right? And that will happen. That's a that's a side issue. It's because we're trying to shore up our supply we're gonna need when we go to like I just listened to and and read a um uh document from DARPA today, and they fully expect us to be at war with China in 36 months. Well, yeah, 32 months now, because that is four months.
SPEAKER_02:I think that's coming. I I didn't I don't see any way around it, like and I think I think what Trump is doing is kind of like as much as I may dislike it, it's necessary. Like it's just is necessary, like otherwise, we'll lose that war before it begins, right? Like, if he doesn't do these things that might be pretty ugly, we're going to lose. That's why the libertarians, I'm watching the libertarians spit out the same freaking arguments about regime change and right this is just like Iran. It's like, no, man, we will lose this war if we do not do if we don't grab Greenland and take over Venezuela and we don't do something, we're done before the war starts.
SPEAKER_04:Or even even the Trads, you know, who all you can see them talk about since just Saturday or whatever is is the evils America, you know, the oh America exports, you know, the the gays and and and voting and all the evils America, like yeah, I get that, but what is the alternative?
SPEAKER_02:You want China to be like do you want Russia America to survive this war? That's what that's that's basically my perspective. Now it's like, do I'm not happy about any of this stuff. I'm not I'm not excited that we're doing this. It's like, do we want America to make it through this war? Because if we don't do these things, we have no chance at it. So, yeah, it's really ugly, and I think there could be really bad blowback from Venezuela because you you don't know what this if this woman's gonna have any ability to contain Venezuela the way uh Maduro did.
SPEAKER_06:Like, we have no idea what's gonna happen. They're already having uprisings there today, yeah. So they've had a military coup since last night. It's funny to me is all these trad monarchist LARPers who want a king until it's time to do king shit, right? And all of a sudden they're freaking out when a guy's trying to do what a king would, you know, like what a guy who is trying to take care of his people would do, yeah, right? Not just some bureaucrat who's elected because he wanted to fight siphon money out of Minneapolis.
SPEAKER_02:So if that's why he's doing it because he's trying to take care of his people, then it's like, all right, I get that.
SPEAKER_06:And I can't, I it's one thing I've never questioned about Trump. He loves Americans, yeah, and he loves America, like everything else about him, uh, whatever his faults are, he loves American people.
SPEAKER_02:And he wants to go down, he wants to go down as the greatest president in American history, like he's a narcissist. He wants to be in the history books as the greatest president in history. So, yeah, like I I'm that's what made me look at the whole situation differently. And I I just know war is coming, like I know it's coming. 100%. Yeah, I want I want to survive it.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, we're in a war now, you all just don't see it very much.
SPEAKER_04:So uh what has come out since we started the show, Aunt, is those those two people that were shot in Portland, Venezuelan gang members who were purposely trying to run over ice, like we are in a low intensity area.
SPEAKER_02:The low intensity, yeah.
SPEAKER_06:This is exactly what it's not it's not low intensity anymore. Yeah, there it's been hot since the well, when I say low intensity, I mean like we're still able to go to work, you know. I mean, like yeah, but even still what you think even in Sarajevo, Sarajevo was still, you know, people are still going to work during during the present there. Yeah, yeah. But the do y'all remember the congressional baseball game where Steven Scalise was shot? Yeah, yeah, right? That's when everything started. That was the turning point. That was that was was that 2012. That was right around Harambe, is when that was. I think it was a couple years before it was like it was during Trump's first presidency. It no, it wasn't. It was before, wasn't it during Obama? I don't think so. I don't think so. Huh? Let's look it up. I need to break out my Google machine, but regardless, um that's when things started getting hot. And things have gone over.
SPEAKER_04:2017, you are right, I'm wrong.
SPEAKER_06:And Tifa has been slowly um fine-tuning their techniques, techniques, tech tactics, and protocols since then. They've gone to um Iran and Iraq to fight with the Kurds, the Peshmerga there, who are all communists, by the way, um, to learn other techniques as well. And they come back and they bring it here, and they're using it here. And then on top of that, like what Ant has said for a long time, is they're using all these um diasporas that are here, right, to slowly start to uh shift the um the balance of power here, right? Um, which is you're completely right in that, uh, which is I'm surprised we got to that because you're you're a high school dropout. But um but that's exactly what's going on. And what's going on now is everything's popping off all at once now. Iran's and their revolution going on, which is probably being pushed on by the CIA and the Massad, um, as well as Venezuela, Honduras is going through some things right now as well. Mexico's been going through some things for a long time.
SPEAKER_04:About 40 minutes ago, apparently, uh Trump announced that the US is going to begin both um special forces and airstrikes within Mexico.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, dude, this is this is like this is the the the the the CIA. Once I understood how the CIA actually worked, is like I always I was just like everybody else, and I and I watched James Bond and Jason Bourne, and I thought that was the CIA, and that's not the CIA. The CIA are these stupid NGOs going in, setting up shop and acting like they're giving you a vaccine, and they're really fomenting revolution on the ground. And dude, the stuff with like all all of like like Richard Branson owns um uh what is it? Uh Virgin Records, he was Virgin Records, right? He'll throw a concert, a Taylor Swift concert, and all the people on the ground will then get they're you like they're using those people to uh to like start revolutions in countries, and that's where all that money for that was earmarked for transgender studies in this country, and that's all that all was. It was just ways for us as the American Empire to covertly control the politics in different regions, and what Trump is doing is going, Yeah, we don't even need that, let's just go in and just do it. And and he's doing it at warp speed because and I weird term, but he's doing he's doing it quickly because I think time is running out and we're coming up on something. And he's like, No, no, no, we don't we don't have another seven years of CIA black ops operations time, we have to do this.
SPEAKER_06:So then the kind of turn this on its head a little bit, and I've kind of brought this up in our show a few times. How does this align with Catholic prophecy? Yeah, right. Because 2029 is a hundred years from the time we were supposed to consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart, right? That's the 100-year mark. Now, whether that's online with what was with the sacred heart, who knows, right? But that's the 100-year mark. But it seems like everything's lining up for end of 2028, early 2029.
SPEAKER_02:That's honestly, I that's that's where it's how does everybody that's why I'm telling you, I don't think Trump's leaving in 2028. Like that, too. Like I'll vote for Trump again.
SPEAKER_06:I know burn this thing down.
SPEAKER_02:I think all of this is is I think all of this climax is in 2028, 2029. Like that's that's how it feels. It feels like we got about three years left of peacetime, and then it's it's popping.
SPEAKER_04:I think there's gonna be wider.
SPEAKER_02:It's gonna be a lot more than peacetime, and like you were just saying, where we're only working on the very large scale war, yeah. Yeah, I but I think full scale war is uh is on the table by the end of Trump's term, like full scale war by the end of Trump's term. That's that's how I've I've I've seen that coming from March.
SPEAKER_06:I'm slowly coming to the opinion that JD Vance is the groomed Manchurian candidate because he was brought completely in power by Peter Thiel, yeah, um, a lot of these other guys, right? So Fuentes is great. He's saying all the right things.
SPEAKER_02:You listen to Fuentes on Palantir and Peter Teal, that kid knows his shit on that, man. It's like kind of freaky.
SPEAKER_06:We used Palantir in Afghanistan to do uh network analysis. Like when I would take down a terrorist in somewhere, you know, some Taliban uh IAV facilitator or something, and we would use Palantir to connect him to other guys to figure out who else does he know. Um, and then I had friends who worked uh at Palantir, um, kind of like training people on how to use it. But we that was in our our operations centers everywhere. We had a guy who just sat there with a computer that was dedicated specifically only to Palantir to help network everybody. And now it's going to be used against us eventually. Yeah. Especially if the left gets in again, which we we it cannot be allowed.
SPEAKER_02:That's the scariest part about everything Trump's doing. He's setting up powers in the presidency that if we lose, like and you give a Gavin Newsom this kind of power, it's a scary thought. Like we're all like, all right, well, Trump's doing it, so it's like whatever.
SPEAKER_06:Well, we just have to make sure he doesn't they don't lose. Like which he's kind of doing right now, especially in like Minneapolis, getting rid of all the Somalis. Uh, we've got Somalis in Alabama too. He's gonna figure out, hey, hey, over here, guys. Don't forget, don't forget. We got some we got some brown people down here too, man. They need to go.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Oh man. Well, listen, it's 10 30 and I have to wake up in the morning, but um man, it's just so much going on. It's like I and and and things will happen quicker and more in more rapid succession as time goes on. Um but yeah, I think I think you're right, like things do happen.
SPEAKER_06:Uh when I say peacetime, I just mean like our day-to-day lives aren't gonna change, but I want to press up on that because people are gonna think you mean like, well, nothing's going on, right? I know what you mean, yeah. But what people hear is, well, then you know it's gonna be peaceful, and you know, stock market's gonna go back up, my 401k is gonna double again, and everything's gonna be great.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, no, no. Look, the thing is, like like we're Catholic, man. Like, we're we're the we're the people of of uh of perpetual optimism because the king wins in the end.
SPEAKER_04:So no matter what comes, we just at the same time, we're also the people of perpetual suffering, so you guys better get ready for it, too.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah, but we we there's value in that suffering, right? We're not yeah, it's not like there's merit in that suffering, so the perpetual suffering of the Jews as victims. The uh there's merit in that suffering. So let's man, just stay in a state of grace, guys. Like, look at look at what happened to um to Supreme Crusader, man.
SPEAKER_06:It's like was he was that out of no like that six days ago, it's like oh I'm feeling probably bad. I got a fever.
SPEAKER_04:He's he's he's had a lot of serious health problems, like he uh has he? Yeah, he he was in the hospital for a serious operation a few years ago and almost didn't make it through. Like I I don't know his history as good as some people online, but I think it was like maybe heart related. Um, so yeah, it's it seems like he came down with a flu six days ago and he died fat.
SPEAKER_06:That flu is killing people, y'all. We've had three young people with no prior medical conditions. I'm talking about like teenagers here in Alabama die.
SPEAKER_04:Well, and you had the last couple of weeks. That um that guy's five-year-old son, I forget his name. Yeah, Chinese Catholic speaker. Wow, I bet he wasn't a Chinese dude. Yeah, you can get so much shit for that. They all look the same, man.
SPEAKER_05:They all look the same.
SPEAKER_02:What do they sound like, Anthony? I gotta go. I gotta getting very right. Getting very rate. Um, I really gotta go, man. Because I'm like, if I'm not asleep by 11, I I get four hours.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, see, he was Korean.
SPEAKER_02:He was Korean.
SPEAKER_06:Well, his name was Kem, so I should have clued us in.
SPEAKER_02:Um, Adrian, it's always fun to catch up with you, brother.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, brother.
SPEAKER_02:Um, y'all take care. When's your uh you guys are doing a show Monday, right? I assume.
SPEAKER_06:Yep, every Monday.
SPEAKER_02:Monday is probably gonna have a lot to talk about.
SPEAKER_06:I'm guessing we are gonna have so much to talk about. It's probably gonna be a three-hour show.
SPEAKER_02:Um I wanted to jump, I wanted to jump on with you guys the other night, and I didn't want to intrude. And then meanwhile, I saw my tweets the next day, and Rob's like, Come on with us. I was like, Are you like are you shitting me?
SPEAKER_04:I even called you on the show because we couldn't figure out uh yeah John Delaney's name. I'm like, hold on, I'll call Ann. He knows Deloney, John Deloney.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, because I've been I thought he was I thought he was Dave Ramsey's son. I think he's Dave Ramsey's son. And it's even worse, he's his employee, and he won't fire him.
SPEAKER_02:Um, yeah, but I'll come, I'll come hang on, guys. Not next week because I gotta go on with Josh and my wife flips if I go on more than two uh three shows a week. But uh yeah, maybe the following week I'll jump on with you guys.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:All right, boys.
SPEAKER_02:Take a take away.
