Bishop Barron on Tucker Carlson

Fresh from his trip to Greece, Anthony shares fascinating observations about Orthodox devotional practices and the stark cultural differences he experienced compared to Rome. This frames a substantive discussion about Bishop Martin's dramatic reversal on Latin Mass restrictions in Charlotte—extending permissions that were initially set to expire. The timing of this decision, coinciding with Cardinal Roche's audience with Pope Leo, suggests significant developments in Rome's approach to traditional liturgy.

We dive into the curious phenomenon of liturgical refugees—Catholics seeking authentic worship in various traditions—and the sometimes contradictory criticisms they level at each other. The irony of Eastern Catholic converts criticizing SSPX attendees highlights the complex landscape Catholics navigate in search of reverent worship. This leads to an insightful analysis of Bishop Barron's interview with Tucker Carlson, examining whether intellectual approaches to faith communication can effectively spark religious revival in a secular age.

At the heart of our conversation lies a critical observation about the masculine nature of traditional worship and its power to attract young men to the faith—a dynamic often missing in contemporary parish settings where feminization has become predominant. We explore how different spiritual temperaments respond to Eastern and Western approaches, while reflecting on what effective evangelization requires in our modern context.

The discussion extends beyond ecclesiastical matters to examine concerning geopolitical developments, particularly Ukraine's targeting of Russia's nuclear capabilities and the implications for global stability. We conclude with reflections on advancing AI technology and its potential threats to privacy, security, and authentic human connection.

Join us for this wide-ranging conversation that connects liturgical preferences to deeper questions about Catholic identity, masculine spirituality, and navigating faith in an increasingly unstable world.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Return From Greece And Show Introduction
• 12:48 Bishop Martin And The Latin Mass Extension
• 36:28 Byzantine Catholics And Traditionalists Debate
• 55:12 Bishop Barron On Tucker Carlson Analysis
• 1:19:50 Cultural Catholicism And Male Leadership
• 1:38:39 Global Conflicts And Technology Concerns
• 1:53:19 AI Threats And Show Wrap-Up

Transcript

Speaker 1: 1:13

Yo, we done with that corny Catholic flow. That lukewarm joint is straight ghosted fam. That cultural Catholic biz man, that's old news. Old news. Kick to the curb. The crusader spirit's wild and rolling in hella deep. We about to scoop up this whole world for christ, going full tilt no front Taffy.

Speaker 2: 1:38

Oh my gosh, it's amazing.

Speaker 1: 1:42

Taffy is a legend. What is going on? Dude, I'm nervous. Tonight I feel like I forgot how to do this. How much did you have to drink in Greece? It was an interesting trip. So for anybody that's new and sees the show title because I see Matt says he just started listening two weeks ago I see Matt said he just started listening two weeks ago, right before I left for Greece. So if you're tuning in because you want to hear the show topic, you guys, if you're listening on the replay, skip ahead. We're not getting to it just yet. Me and Rob haven't spoken in two weeks. Rob was ranting like a lunatic in the group chat this morning, so we got a few things to get to. We also do not want to forget to do our ad read. So yeah, it's been a little bit man.

Speaker 2: 2:34

It has been a while.

Speaker 1: 2:35

I checked out the episode you did with Jason and Mark. It was actually a very good episode, mark got right into it just so quick I loved it right off the bat. He was like ready to go. I got cooked in the sun, man. I was interested to see my dark complexion next to your pasty white skin yeah, you definitely look african yeah, you haven't. You still look transparent.

Speaker 2: 2:59

So and I actually got a sunburn on Saturday this is Dan. This is this is Dan. This is.

Speaker 1: 3:06

Dan Robbins Um yeah, dude, fricking Greece. I went ah man, I was there for eight days and I did it. I did Italy for 12 days and then I did Greece for eight days. When I went to Italy, I was able to blend in and pick things up, pick up language things. I work with Italian guys. I work with Spanish guys. We're Latin at heart. You know the Romance languages. You go to Greece.

Speaker 1: 3:37

I spent eight days there and still cannot figure out how to say thank you, which is like, or something like that. Spent eight days there and still cannot figure out how to say thank you, which is like if, if, or something like that. And I'm like I would say, and people look to me like what, what are you? What are you trying to say? I don't understand it's. It's cemented my, my latin heritage way further than I thought it would it.

Speaker 1: 3:58

There was some very cool devotional stuff there that I saw. So like because there's no separation of church and state. The island of Mykonos can only get power if they would have to build a private chapel and the metropolitan would have to approve of it to get the government to bring power in and then people could, in the surrounding areas, break off that power line, like that's. That's how involved the metropolitan of the area is. It's really interesting.

Speaker 1: 4:32

So there's like throughout the island there are just these tiny little personal chapels that you can't even go in and what they do is it's like after a family member dies, three years later, you can put their remains in, and what they do is it's like after a family member dies three years later, you can put their remains in there or something, and it could just be used as a devotional chapel. So those were scattered throughout the Island. The then like there was like these weird like even at the airport the customs guy would have like a little Holy card to one of the Mount Athos saints, you know St St Paisos or something.

Speaker 2: 5:09

So there, was like the St Paisos. They canonize Jeff Paisos Really.

Speaker 1: 5:14

Paisos, maybe, I don't know. I can't, I can't pronounce a single Greek word.

Speaker 2: 5:19

Yeah, we knew that. I knew that when I met you in supermanville and you were calling them gyros.

Speaker 1: 5:26

I actually argued with every greek person there about their pronunciation of gyro and I argue with a few people about them making the sign of the cross backwards well, that's that makes sense.

Speaker 1: 5:37

Yeah, I'm sorry they're dyslexic when it comes to devotions they, they do everything backwards, everything is backwards in greece, I don't know, it's pays, yeah, it's, it's spelled pesos or I don't know. I mean pisos, pesos, I don't know. So yeah, it was a fun trip. I went with the family. We'll have uh, I'll, I'll be. I really I'll share more in the after show about it a gyroscope right, we all know it's not a gyroscope, that's a callback.

Speaker 1: 6:08

Um, so we'll, we'll talk about that on the other side, because this, this thing is that. That, that's, that's a more personal family stuff we'll talk about over there, but, um, so we only make that available to 1200 people instead of 30 000 yes, yeah, pretty much. Um. What happened while I was gone? What happened? I saw charlotte went up in flames. Uh, bishop martin decided to torch the latin mass and then it seems he got. What do you think happened there? Do you think he got a little talking to?

Speaker 2: 6:43

I don't necessarily think it's a coincidence that on the day leo receives roche for the very first time in audience is the day that martin now says he'll, you know, give an extension, when in his letter that priests were supposed to tell everyone an extension wasn't possible. But now suddenly it is on the day that Roche gets called into Leo.

Speaker 1: 7:09

And what's it? What's interesting is he said originally it was going to be what? The end of June, that was a wrap, Everything's something in July 2nd.

Speaker 2: 7:17

Now it's October 8th.

Speaker 1: 7:19

So yeah, he pushes it off to the october deadline. That tradition onus originally said yeah and he also says uh, and if the vatican makes any adjustments to tradition?

Speaker 2: 7:32

which, why would anyone like? Why would you that? I mean, that seems weird to just drop in the middle of nowhere, right?

Speaker 1: 7:41

So you, you think, you think he was allowed to save face.

Speaker 2: 7:46

I think, yes, I think that someone from the Vatican called him, more or less, and told him you know this is going to be changing this summer. You can do, you know, you can say that you're going to move it to the original deadline in order to make it. You know, like you said, to save face.

Speaker 1: 8:05

So, Because there was. What's interesting is the bishop in his original letter, had mentioned podcasts and bloggers, yeah, and made it like the reason this was happening was because of podcasts and bloggers, like the reason this was happening was because of podcasts and bloggers. But it seems like podcasters and bloggers and the noise they made and the fuss they made about that decision kind of made enough noise that it got back to Rome.

Speaker 1: 8:33

It's possible, I mean it was, it was, it was all I was seeing on my Twitter feed. I mean it was, I mean that's kind of Twitter world, but I mean every single Catholic publishing company was talking about it.

Speaker 2: 8:47

It definitely got outside of Twitter.

Speaker 1: 8:49

Yeah, so it's like it likely got back to Rome. Roche went to meet with Leo today. Now they also made the announcements that all of the dicastery positions will be announced by August.

Speaker 2: 9:05

August, yeah, so I think by August we will have some kind of adjustment to Traditionis it wouldn't surprise me if in August we get a new head of the CDW or whatever it's called now ddw, whatever and whoever that is releases, you know, a prepared document, either taking, you know getting rid of tc, or limiting it, or reinterpreting it, whatever I think I I don't think they're getting rid of it, I don't think you're not going back to some more of them.

Speaker 1: 9:39

I think what will happen is extensions will be granted, that like permission will be given for anyone who requests it. Permission will be given because it's essentially what they're saying. If a bishop requests an extension, what is actually happening there is the bishop is saying, hey, this is actually functioning well in my diocese. There's. It's not causing any strife in my it's. It's kind of giving permission back to the. It's giving authority back to the bishops in each diocese to make the decision on their own, which is better than TC, not as good as some more. So some more. I'm gave every single priest the ability to say it and if you got enough people in your parish to request it, the diocese would actually provide you with a priest.

Speaker 1: 10:24

That was some more of them you know, which is pretty wild if you think about it I mean not really, it's the roman rite, yeah no, no, I'm saying it's the roman rite should have the ability to say the roman rite, no matter what a bishop thinks 100.

Speaker 1: 10:38

I'm saying it's pretty wild that, like benedict even removed it from the like, he almost put onus on the bishop to provide it, like he didn't, he didn't. You know what I mean it's. It was kind of like he said look, if they're requesting this, I I want every bishop to give it to them. You know, he, he, it was the opposite of tradition in a way, you know yeah, for sure, yeah.

Speaker 1: 11:03

So it would be amazing if it went back to that. I don't think it's going to, but I do think permission will be granted wherever it's asked, which is good, because I think a lot of the diocese in latin mass is like I don't think most of the bishops are upset about that. I think for the most part they are peaceful communities. A lot of them are are parishes that say both forms of the mass and you know the mutual enrichment thing is nonsense, but I do think it will allow people who have those communities to continue to find All right.

Speaker 1: 11:40

So we'll get into your gripe with a lot of the, the byzantine catholics. Do we have to? Yeah, yeah, I definitely want to, because we we saw a voice of reason clip where he was going off on the sspx saying they're schismatic and things like that, and the irony of a mexican novus ordo catholic escaping to the east because he wants to get away from the novus ordo, then coming down on people who are trying to find some way out of the the novus ordo, so they go to the sspx and calling them like it's. It is such a bizarre thing to me. Yeah, I'm not even knocking Eastern Catholics, like if you're an Eastern Catholic and you are going there to escape the Novus Ordo like I don't even think that's wrong.

Speaker 2: 12:33

No, it's not wrong, right Cause, I would do it if I had the ability. Yeah, but here's the thing I'm a Latin Catholic. The second, the Roman Rite, is available to me again. I will always fight for the Roman Rite because that's my patrimony. So to be baptized a Latin Catholic and then to attack Latin Catholics for wanting their patrimony and saying that now you venerate a heretic like Palamas, give me a. Give me a break shut your mouth.

Speaker 1: 13:05

So wait, you're so okay. So what? I don't even know, like the, a lot of the, like the inner workings of these, these different eastern catholic groups that were allowed back into communion with rome. But you're saying some of them get to deny the filioque, they don't get to deny it.

Speaker 2: 13:23

They have to say that they believe it. But they get to admit it. They never have to actually say the filioque and the creed. Their creed is different than the creed of the Latin church.

Speaker 1: 13:33

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 13:35

You know, they just have to say that they believe it. They get to venerate so-calledcalled saints like photius, who you know was the cause of the phocian schism, you know, and yeah, he did, he did reconcile, I'll you know. I won't say he died a schismatic, but he caused a huge, huge schism. They get to venerate palamus, who many consider an open heretic, like, yeah, the amount of freedom the eastern catholics have compared to the freedom that the roman church gives us latin catholics is incredible yeah.

Speaker 1: 14:12

So, like I said, I don't have an issue if somebody goes to an eastern liturgy because they would prefer that over the nova sordo, because the Nova Sordo is a wreck. My issue is when they then tell you well, this is why Traditionis needed to happen, things like that, like those things.

Speaker 2: 14:31

Yeah, the fact that he went to an Eastern parish because it's all he could find open during COVID. Yeah. Now he criticizes everyone who went to the SSBX because it's all they could find open during COVID, and calls them schismatic, while he venerates an open heretic. Is that what he says?

Speaker 1: 14:50

Is that why he says he's an Eastern Catholic?

Speaker 2: 14:52

I don't know, I don't watch the guy, but I have seen someone say that. He said that he went to an Eastern parish for the first time during COVID because it's all he could find open.

Speaker 1: 15:06

Dude, the hypocrisy is just incredible. Oh my gosh, that is so insane to me. So we have to read this tweet. Yeah, let me pull that up. You have to pull this tweet up because it's one of the greatest, funniest tweets I've ever read.

Speaker 2: 15:26

Let me find it here and the fact that it not like it won't ever get promoted because it's a reply to our tweets, sucks.

Speaker 1: 15:31

I mean, I tried to, I tried to, I tried to get it out there a bit, but okay, let me, uh, let me make it bigger here yes, we're talking about voice of reason and and it's it's just like to me and you know who else drives me.

Speaker 1: 15:46

Nuts are the unicorn Novus Ordo people, because they happen to have a Novus Ordo where there's ad orientum, no altar, girls receiving kneeling and on the tongue, and it's like they act like that is the norm throughout. Like it, it is a liturgical wasteland everywhere. So if you happen to find this one parish that celebrates the nova sordo, like it's at saint john canty, is it's like good for you, very happy for you, real proud of you statistically, it's far more less common than the tlm it's just insane.

Speaker 1: 16:24

It's like so most of us have to drive an hour plus to go to mass on sunday if we want to find something worth going to. So it's yes, so this is. This is so what. Matt and cleveland's saying it's like okay. So the unicorn nova, sort of may be a little worse. Matt and cleveland's saying it's like okay, so the unicorn novus ordo may be a little worse, in the sense that they think it's everywhere, in every diocese. It's not like you cannot find these things. They're, they're, they're nowhere. Uh, we don't say the filioque, we say the original nicene constantinople creed. It's affirmed but not stated. You fraud how do?

Speaker 3: 17:01

you look yourself in the mirror.

Speaker 1: 17:02

You make me sick to be fair.

Speaker 2: 17:05

I'm not saying that eastern catholics don't actually believe the philoque. Yeah, because I'm sure many of them do.

Speaker 1: 17:11

I'm not saying that I, uh, if I was ever in a position where they did like end the latin mass in my diocese, I'd have two choices. It would be the sspx or the Byzantine Catholic church. That's fine. Both of those are five minutes from me. Like I have maybe 10 minutes, like I have an SSPX that's 10 minutes away. I choose to drive an hour to stay in the diocese and Latin mass, not because I have a particular opinion of the SSPX. It's more because my wife and kids, just like love the parishes that the diocesan is at. But if I had to go Eastern Catholic over the Nova Sordo I'm I probably would do it, but I would never tell anyone you you know, you know it'd be funny.

Speaker 2: 17:59

You'd be the Tolkien of the Eastern parishes. You'd be standing up and you'd be making this huge normal sign of the cross in front of everyone.

Speaker 1: 18:09

I got very uncomfortable with one of our cab drivers when we were talking about the sign of the cross, because my in-laws didn't know what I was talking about.

Speaker 2: 18:18

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 18:19

And I'm talking to the guy. I'm like why do you make the sign of the cross backwards? And like they thought I was like insulting him I was just goofing around with the guys not that big of a deal they were like why, why are you insulting his religion? I'm like not insulting his religion, but the same religion. What are you talking about?

Speaker 2: 18:36

I'd be like shut up, lutheran. You'll know when I when I make fun of someone's religion.

Speaker 1: 18:44

Here's the tweet, by the way, okay, so be eastern right catholic from iraq. That's decades of violence, decimates your minority demographic. For safety of family, upend life in the homeland and migrate to the us to start anew. Start an eastern right mass location with other expats of the same tight-knit background. Anglo dude with the name like frad starts coming here. Hispanic dude with the name like jurado jurado starts coming there. They mispronounce your name while showing you their tobacco pipe, tell you how base their, how base this mass of hours is, and they invited their novus ordo friends from lord of the rings fan club. Meet up more.

Speaker 1: 19:21

Western europeans, africans, latin americans, show up and take your family's usual pew up front like they own the place. It's like they're, these guys are going to the eastern parish and they're trying to latinize it. So you're, so you're actually losing the, the beauty of, of the culture that should belong in the like there. Somebody was making it like. I was saying this is a cultural thing, like, and it is, though, right. So my, my issue with the guys who go Orthodox like I, I it's a. There's a different thing in going Eastern Catholic and going Orthodox. It's like I understand the people that go Orthodox, go Eastern Catholic, because it's like, well, you know. I know what the alternative is the guys that are going Orthodox though it's like. Your name is Patrick, you're from.

Speaker 2: 20:11

Florida. I saw that tweet You're from your Patrick from Florida.

Speaker 1: 20:16

You don't have some deep mystical Eastern spirituality, dude Stop it. You're Catholic, you deep mystical Eastern spirituality dude, stop it. You're Catholic. You're Latin Catholic Like you. Just don't want to go to the Novus Ordo either. So all of I think everybody's just trying to do their best to find a community where they can live out their faith, where holiness is taught and preached, and that could be an SSPX parish, that could be a Byzantine Catholic parish, that could be a diocesan Latin mass, like. That's just kind of the situation we're in right now, because your average Novus Ordo is so upside down right now. It's just, it's just not. It's just not Catholic in the like the great sense of the word.

Speaker 2: 20:57

No, it's not.

Speaker 1: 20:59

It's, it's like. It's like what did you say? I don't, I don't know your spot, but it's like the the when did I say when I? Don't remember when you you were saying like this thing wearing the catholic skin suit we don't have to go that deep into it.

Speaker 2: 21:16

This is a fake and gay monstrosity, uh larping is the catholic church, somethingarping is the Catholic.

Speaker 1: 21:22

Church, Something like that. You know, it's just that's kind of what your average parish is like. It really is hard to find a good parish.

Speaker 2: 21:32

You know it's funny, you'll have all these, all these well most of them are yeah, biz LARPers for lack of a better term going after the SSPX on Twitter and saying that you know their masses are illicit and you can't go there. And then, when, like canon losses, you can fulfill your obligation at any Catholic rite, like. So you're arguing that the SSPX saying the traditional Roman rite isn't a Catholic rite, and yet your Novus Ordo mass with Jewish meal prayers is.

Speaker 1: 22:04

Yeah, it's weird man.

Speaker 2: 22:06

Like, if your Novus Ordo Mass is a Catholic rite and you can fulfill your obligation there, then you probably do so doubly so. At like an SSPX Mass.

Speaker 1: 22:17

I just think it's like I said, it's like I think everybody has to do what they have to do to get their family to heaven right now.

Speaker 2: 22:23

A new crusade really wants you to read this.

Speaker 1: 22:26

Thoughts on converts who were no, I think he really wants the first part.

Speaker 1: 22:30

Oh, and look, I've lost a decent amount of weight. Yes, what's crazy is I gained weight on vacation, and then I came back home and I went right back to fasting as soon as I got home, like I ate whatever I wanted on vacation. But I came home and I went right back to fasting when I got home and I lost everything I gained on vacation and then lost a few more pounds like I'm not. I'm never going back to eating the way I did, like I. I don't know. I'm trying my best, but what was this question after that? Thank you, though.

Speaker 2: 23:00

Oh, just what we're talking about brought converts converting to visiting catholicism um, it's bizarre to me too.

Speaker 1: 23:10

Like, or orthodoxy, even right, like it's, it's. It's strange to me. I'm not saying it's, I'm not saying it's not valid or something, it's just it's strange to me. Like I went to, I went to Greece and I did not fit in there, like it was just alien to me, the culture, everything was just so alien to me. When I went, when I went to Rome, I felt at home. You know, it's like, and people spoke English in Greece. It's not just the language, it was just an alien culture. It wasn't it would be like it, it just felt very different than Rome did. Like when I went to Rome, I felt at home, it was, it was like embracing our Catholic heritage, it was, it was really awesome. It was one of the most like, awe inspiring trips I'd ever taken, because I got to see the culture that built Western civilization, you know. So it's.

Speaker 2: 24:09

I was going to say because Greece was basically outside of Christendom for the last thousand years right. Well, we would consider Christendom yeah. So it wasn't formed by Christendom the way that Italy was and that you know. The land that our ancestors came from, you know, was formed by Christendom.

Speaker 1: 24:32

Yeah yeah, the church in the West and the church in the East developed very differently and it's I don't know. I mean, I just I think that you, you can fall in love with the Eastern devotions and stuff, but I think, like, like even Bobby Bobby goes to an Eastern Catholic parish, but like, if there was an awesome Latin mass near him, like he would go to that I know he would Like, he, he, he, he. It's just, you're more at home there as a Westerner. You know you have to, you have to learn different things. It's it doesn't feel. It doesn't feel right. At first I would imagine like, but but I will say this though like my first time going to a Latin mass felt, felt weird, right, like I didn't feel at home immediately, but after attending four in a row I felt more at home there than I did back at the Nova Sordo. Like, when I go to Nova Sordo I don't feel at home anymore, I feel like I'm in a Protestant service. It feels really strange.

Speaker 1: 25:38

Yeah never, I'm not going to?

Speaker 2: 25:39

Yeah, it is a.

Speaker 1: 25:42

Protestant service, but okay, it just, it just feels like that. It's not. I'm not going to. Yeah, it is a Protestant service, but okay, it just, it just feels like that. It's not. I'm not. I'm not going to say that it's a cat, it's a Catholic mass and it's, you know, jesus is definitely present and it's definitely a valid Eucharist and all that. So I'm not, I'm not knocking anywhere that goes to it, it's just the. Yeah, I did, like, honestly, jim, like I'll always, I'll always uh, have respect for taylor for throwing that challenge out there, because it changed my, my whole life. Essentially, they changed my whole spiritual life, that's for sure. Um, all right, so, yeah, so we can get to bishop baron. Um, did you watch any of it, rob?

Speaker 2: 26:19

not a minute, no, huh no, he's, he's like the catholic jordan peterson to me.

Speaker 1: 26:25

I can't stand him so the thing with baron is that he's uh, you want to throw a time stamp in, so you know where to cut the clip and we'll throw this up as a clip later.

Speaker 2: 26:37

So the the thing with baron we need to get to an ad read too, by the way.

Speaker 1: 26:41

You want to do that first and then we'll jump into Baron. Yeah, probably a good idea. Yeah, let's do that. So do you have it available Because I have totally space. It's been a while. You know, the ad read these poor people.

Speaker 2: 27:00

The ad read in the episode without you was the best one we've ever done Is it really I didn't get to that part. I mean we didn't get to it until 40 minutes into the show, but it was a good ad read.

Speaker 1: 27:13

I'm going to disagree with you on the spirituality part. It's much the same way. People have Benedictine, franciscan, carmelite spirituality. I'm very much drawn to apophatic theology. Apophatic, what is it, bobby? Can you throw normal words in here? Theology, and I find myself relating to the mystics more than the manualists. I think I might, I'm not, I'm not, I don't have like a Thomistic mind, like I don't, I don't, my mind doesn't work like a Thomas. Like when I talk to Nick, sometimes like I'm just like wow, I don't know where I do. Kind of like, um, I don't know, I, I, whatever, I I do. Kind of like the mystery of the East, which is something I've always, you know, said but yeah.

Speaker 2: 28:03

But is it only mysterious because it's alien?

Speaker 1: 28:07

No, I, I like, like, I think, I, I. I think it's a good thing that the Latin West, especially through Tomism, like try to find the metaphysical reality for every little thing. But I also like to be like all right, maybe, like okay, yeah, I have the definition of transubstantiation, but like I don't need to comprehend what's actually happening there, Like I don't need the definition for it, I just know that that's Jesus Christ up there. Like I kind of like that, Like when I, when I teach my kids about it, I don't teach them what transubstantiation is. I, I Well, it's not that I don't, that's not what I mean. They obviously know what transubstantiation is. What I'm saying is it was more seeing it through the story of the old Testament and maybe not fully knowing exactly what's happening there, but like you're you, you you believe it.

Speaker 1: 29:07

Regard like you I don't know uh, whatever, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with homism.

Speaker 2: 29:11

I'm not knocking I find it how my mind works personally, like I find it easier to get into the mysteries of the faith through like scholasticism, through like learning. You know, through like learning, the definition of transubstantiation. To me, like that, that makes it easier to go deeper into into the.

Speaker 1: 29:36

The mystery for me, yeah yeah, I think I I don't just I don't think that there's anything. I just I think it's just a different way. It could be a temperament thing, it could be just a way of like your mind works too. You know, yeah, like for sure, like, like this. That's why, like, I like listening to certain things and you don't like. It's just like, you know. That's why you always hate people that I enjoy and I don't like people that you enjoy. It's just. I think it's just a. You know, it can be a difference and that could be a preference.

Speaker 2: 30:08

Yeah, it's just part of the bet for me to hit everyone you like, we'll do the end read.

Speaker 1: 30:16

Then we'll get into Baron, because I actually did listen to the Baron interview and I and I see both, both, I see both takes on it like I do see the good in it and I also see the critique in it, so it'll be interesting to to uh discuss.

Speaker 2: 30:39

You got the ad read.

Speaker 1: 30:40

Yeah, I'm just seeing how long it would take before it became too awkward for you.

Speaker 2: 30:43

It is awkward. I don't have like the ad read. We'll just so for anyone who doesn't know, we are sponsored by you know, the fact that you all give me crap for how I say this word makes it really hard for me to say this word now. But we're sponsored by requisite Requisite.

Speaker 1: 31:00

Are you kidding me? At this point, you still don't know how to say it. Why?

Speaker 5: 31:04

do you want me to do?

Speaker 1: 31:05

the ad read, because I thought you were going to give me a little thing to read. But Requisite sellers guys, if you go to Requisite sellers dot com, they are my favorite Catholic company out there. They're the only ones brave enough to sponsor us. They're the only ones. They've never, ever criticized anything we've said, even when we criticize, like the people of the old covenant, nothing. They're just like you guys do whatever you want to do?

Speaker 2: 31:29

I pronounce their name wrong every time for the last four months. Rob never gets their name right. I don't care.

Speaker 1: 31:31

Every one of their ad reads are a jumbled mess. I know we have Father's Day coming up, right. Yes, father's Day is coming up in Juneune. It's a great gift idea. So we'll try to get like the next week. We'll see if we could get them to bump it up and get get another discount too for father's day. But father's day is coming up very great gift idea. If you have a birthday coming up, also a great gift idea. Um, their wine selection is awesome and it is very important that we support catholic uh family businesses and they have they're.

Speaker 2: 32:06

They're also a fruit farm and, uh, the fruit should be getting ripe somewhat soon, I would imagine, with it being june now, so order a fruit and wine from them yeah, get.

Speaker 1: 32:16

uh. Use the code based b-a-s-e-d at checkout for 10% off. We love the people over at Recky's and Cellars Even had Molly and Laura went out and visited the actual winery and she says that the sangria is perfect for hot days. So I'm going to actually order the sangria, because I usually don't like sangria, but it doesn't taste like sangria, like typical sangria. It's a wine blend.

Speaker 2: 32:49

Right, it's not wine with sugary fruit juice added.

Speaker 1: 32:52

Exactly yeah, so don't be mistaken by that. But yeah, go check them out, guys. Recky's and Cellars I mean we have a clip or two we could play, yeah, and are you getting a couple bottles for your teens? We'll talk about the drinking with my the the thing you said about your daughter.

Speaker 2: 33:12

I think that was a tag so I'm not going to say it, but what you said about your daughter, it was hilarious we'll talk about that over on the other side.

Speaker 1: 33:20

That's, that's locals. That's locals come uh content. I. I did look. Well, the thing is my, my 18 and 19 year old are old enough to drink in greece, so I like we went out hanging out with my kids, like me and my wife, so we'll talk about that on the other side though. Um, let me just see if I can actually find you actually send the so I sent the, I sent the sub stack, you sent it also I know but, any clips yeah, I have.

Speaker 1: 33:52

I have a clip hang on. I'll send it now give me a sec. I'm sorry guys. Oh, I know you guys can't stand this this. We came so prepared, so I had.

Speaker 2: 34:12

You know, paul. You're right. Paul says the drinking should be 15 or 16. If we're ever going to combat the falling, the decline of people drinking, alcoholism and smoking weed, we need to get people drinking young. That's why Wisconsin is the greatest state and the greatest state.

Speaker 1: 34:33

The drunkest. Oh man, I don't know if I'm going to be able to find the clip from me. Oh, here it is. Okay, I got it. I'm going to send it. I'll send it down, okay. So I had this clip and then, what's his name? Had a good clip, trevor, at Tridentine. I'll send that one over to you. Yeah, all right. Well, let's play Trevor's clip first. I'm going to send that one over to you, okay.

Speaker 2: 35:06

Be careful, okay, be careful, okay, guys.

Speaker 1: 35:10

All right, we're good.

Speaker 2: 35:12

Okay, because you don't want to stick it in too far. I'm going to do that. Bye, Iggy.

Speaker 3: 35:20

Close the door Love you, love you, love you.

Speaker 1: 35:26

How is Hope's pregnancy going? Yeah, it's going pretty well. Yes, do we have. Do we have a closer due date yet, or what? Because I gotta come and hang out with those kids and give them noisy toys and sugary drinks and they don't generally just adjust the due date like all the time it's still like august 18th or 19th august 18th.

Speaker 1: 35:46

All right, all right, let's play tre play Trevor's clip first, because Trevor said this clip of Bishop Barron on Tucker really brought home the need for the church to clarify its condemnation of usury in the context of a modern market economy. Tucker rightfully hits on usury often in the show and was clearly not fully satisfied with the answer. So let's jump into that clip.

Speaker 5: 36:31

So let's jump into that Cliff dynamics of a market economy better. What it tends to mean now is, you know, loaning at exorbitant interest or loaning in a way that's deeply abusive toward others.

Speaker 4: 36:35

It doesn't mean that in itself it's intrinsically evil, because then the capital so how would the church feel about like a credit card that charges 25%?

Speaker 5: 36:43

interest. Yeah, it would be wary of it. It would want some kind of regulation and some kind of oversight of those things. John Paul II would say the economy needs to be regulated morally and legally. So there should be a moral regulation. And see, that comes from the churches, it comes from a clear teaching about the moral life and care for the poor and so on, but also a legal regulation to some degree. The best statement of it, I think, is John Paul II. It's called Centesimus Annus, written in 1991 on the Centesimus Annus, the hundredth year of Rerum Novarum. That's the clearest expression, I think, of the balance of Catholic social teaching. I think this man is signaling that he likes that tradition and what did he say about usury?

Speaker 5: 37:31

He didn't talk about usury specifically, but he has a paragraph where he says do we? Support the market economy. If by that you mean one that encourages entrepreneurship, that is based upon private property, that allows even for a profit motive and he goes through various things, the answer is yes. If by that you mean one that is completely unregulated legally or morally, one that exploits the poor, one that excludes most people from participation in it, then the answer is no.

Speaker 4: 37:57

And so he kind of sets the parameters for how we think about the economy is that, um, that feels, I mean, I'm so grateful, grateful to the Catholic Church for standing up for life, for opposing killing.

Speaker 1: 38:11

Yeah, it's.

Speaker 2: 38:12

That was you can tell he? Really didn't know, like the fact that he can only mention a JB2 document from 1990 and not like any of the dozens of Catholic you know teachings on usury from before. That Like, if you just don't know the answer, just say you don't know like I.

Speaker 2: 38:30

There there was a point where baron didn't know the saint michael prayer I, I, you know I've seen that and I I just I don't know if I can believe that without seeing it so the the the thing is baron is a very post-conciliar guy.

Speaker 1: 38:48

Like all of his upbringing is in post-conciliar stuff, like he talks about it all the time, how he's like we were discouraged from praying the rosary. So the thing is he's read a lot of philosophy and he's read a lot of Augustine and things like that. So to me Barron is one of those guys where if you've seen like a few Barron interviews, you're not getting anything new from this. Like you're going to get the same talking points Barron kind of has memorized about philosophy and about, you know, man's quest for God and he kind of quotes the same points of Augustine. He'll get into Kant and he'll talk about von Balthasar.

Speaker 2: 39:30

Okay, but see, it's weird for a Catholic to want to talk about Kant and not, you know, like the medieval scholastics.

Speaker 1: 39:38

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 39:39

It's like he's read just enough to be able to answer the most basic talking points of your average like read it atheist, and he decided he never needed to go further than that so the okay.

Speaker 1: 39:53

But the thing is that is who he has been engaging. I know for the for the past two decades that I've been watching him right, like he's been. He started off like engaging the, the new atheist movement online, so that's kind of how he rose to prominence. He, he did his catholicism series but all of even that stuff like it's funny that he talks about beige catholicism all the time because he's the definition of it he's, he's not that.

Speaker 1: 40:21

Look, I don't consider baron a bad guy like I. I didn't know, I'm not saying he is. He's not a bad guy like baron is. Look, he's the only bishop I see willing to get into spaces where conservative catholics are like I don't you know, like he really is. Like, you see, any other bishop. You think any other bishop in the USCCB would go and sit with Tucker Carlson? Honestly, yeah.

Speaker 2: 40:54

There's a couple maybe a handful at most. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 40:59

Very few. Like most of those guys think Tucker Carlson is a villain, barron is willing to sit down with where he saw, where he sees young men go. So, like I know you don't like peterson, but he got castigated for speaking with jordan peterson from guys like mike lewis and the and the and the liberal catholics. Like those guys hate baron and they hate him. I'm not. I know he's not a trad. I'm like don't think I'm. I'm not. I know he's not a Trad. Like don't think I'm Not. I know he's not A trickling trickling would. That's True. Um, trickling, definitely would. Um. I'm not Saying he's a trad in any way whatsoever. What I'm saying is he's the. He's one of the few Bishops I see trying to engage Young men when I see everybody else catering to Women.

Speaker 2: 41:46

I see I see Baron is. I don't think he's trying to engage. What makes you think he's trying to engage men?

Speaker 1: 41:52

He's going to where men are listening, like he's talking about Bob Dylan.

Speaker 2: 41:58

Yeah, he's so hard. Maybe he's trying, but he's got to be one of the worst at it. Oh man, this good cop, bad cop routine really gets hard. Sometimes for me it's easier to play bad cop.

Speaker 1: 42:18

I can see you trying so hard and then I say something you're like, yeah, easier to play bad cop, all right, so why don't we bring up the sub stack? Because the sub stack. So I woke up this morning I read the sub stack from um, uh crap, I'm forgetting his name, chris do we have a clip of him screwing up the saint michael prayer?

Speaker 1: 42:34

no, somebody has that. Send it over, though I don't. I didn't actually see it. I didn't get to that point in the interview, but I saw somebody say it if anyone has that clip on twitter, sent uh dm it to me um you don't follow me oh man jd no wait, what do you say?

Speaker 2: 42:51

jd says tobin engages you.

Speaker 1: 42:53

Oh, come on um, okay, so tucker interviews baron baseball balthazar and bob dylan the sub stack.

Speaker 2: 43:03

That's what you're reading from yeah, okay, let me pull that up um, let's shout.

Speaker 1: 43:08

Let's shout him out too, if anybody wants to go and read this. Chris Jackson on Twitter. So there's something mesmerizing about watching Tucker Carlson try to drag God out of the mouth of a company man. That's what this four-hour-plus interview with Bishop Barron felt like a sustained, almost heroic effort to pull something supernatural out of someone who has spent a lifetime trying to make the faith digestible for a world that doesn't believe. And you could sense Carlson's confusion. He wanted to understand why Christianity triggers such unhinged rage from the secular elite. He wanted to know why the church appears to be collapsing. He wanted to talk about evil, transcendence and martyrdom. What he got was Bishop Barron explaining how a good coach teaches you to smell the grass. That's not to say Barron's points weren't occasionally interesting. They were. He's not a dumb man. He's read a great deal. He knows how to sprinkle in Hopkins and Aquinas.

Speaker 1: 44:02

But what's missing from Barron's performance is what is always missing from his brand of boomer apologetics the prophetic clarity to name the crisis for what it is and to actually do something about it. Now, this is something that has been a continuous frustration of mine with baron, even when he was talking to shia labeouf, right like when, when he was talking to shia labeouf and shia was telling him about the traditional latin mass, and he's like well, do you? Why are you attracted to it? Well, because it's like they're they're not trying to sell me a car. And Barron will then go into talking about how they you know beige Catholicism is presented and you know there's a D emphasis on hell and you know there's a lack of call to young men to strive for something great, and then he will go and push the von balthasar stuff, which is the, dare we hope. Hell is empty. So it's like in in one sense he understands what the problem is and in the other he's kind of continuing it. So instead we get the same old trick that has defined baron's entire ministry diagnose the disease with great intelligence, then prescribe a placebo. That's a good line.

Speaker 1: 45:10

Barron admits that ecclesial liberalism is a reduction of the supernatural to the natural. True, but he says that as if the project he is behind, as if the project is behind us. He says that as if he didn't come up through that system. He says it as if word on fire hasn't been ground zero for that same reductionism, repackaged in Thomistic drag for the YouTube generation. Harsh, but I don't, chris, you're a good writer man.

Speaker 1: 45:38

When Carlson asks about the supernatural collapse in the church, barron blames cultural accommodation, the sexual revolution and Kant. What he never names is Vatican II. Not honestly, not directly. Instead, he insists that Vatican II was a bold missionary council, tragically misunderstood by its implements. People like, well, bishop Barrett, this is a tired playbook.

Speaker 1: 45:57

Separate the text from the disaster it caused. Blame the fallout on the post-conciliar period, pretend the modernist theology was not embedded in the council itself, despite every syllable of Gaudium et spes, no suretate and dignitatis humanae crying out to the contrary. Insist it was all meant to be Thomistic outreach and missionary zeal, even though the church had never hemorrhaged vocations or mass attendance on that scale before or since. This is like blaming the Titanic sinking on a post-iceberg development. Oh, man, barron names Kant, nietzsche, the Enlightenment, but never Dignitatis Humanae, never Nostra Aetate, and certainly not the de facto demolition of the Roman Rite or the 60-year-long failure to anathematize heresy. Man, this is true In his telling the church just got a little too apologetic after the council. Not heretical, not disoriented, not infiltrated, just bashful.

Speaker 1: 46:51

Barron cannot admit that the modern church is in ruins because it is built on sand. That would indict everything. So instead he gently mourns the liberal moment and assures us that the supernatural is now making a comeback. Is now making a comeback? Is it because the new pope because the new pope baron refuses to critique just affirmed for all in the words of consecration? I heard that might have been a translation error. Um, where so pope leo had said uh, the sacrifice is for you and for all. I don't know if that is accurate. That could have been a translation error. But Leo's kind of.

Speaker 1: 47:38

We're all getting so excited about Leo. I'm like man, he hasn't really. I don't know, man, I'm not going to start that. I'm not going to start that. I'm not going to be the guy who starts it, but I'm very hopeful that you know we're going to get some answers on the Latin mass soon. But the way Leo is, kind of he is, he does seem to be correcting some of Francis's stuff. But, like you want to see something a little more bold, you want to see somebody come out and just say the truth with clarity, not this timid. Francis was great. We're just going to tweak this little thing here and tweak this little thing here.

Speaker 2: 48:24

I don't think we're ever going to see that from Leo Just coming out and saying, just repudiating Francis. But if, if all we get is him coming out and doing little tweaks here and there, that's a lot better than what we could have got.

Speaker 1: 48:40

Yeah, yeah, no, listen, I'm. It's much better than what we had, like that's for sure. So there's no question that baron believes in god, but there's a real. But there's a reason. His word on fire ministry has failed to spark any serious revival. His vision of catholicism is heavy on intellectual ambience and light on clarity. It is a church where beauty will save the world, as long as you don't look too closely at the felt banners or pantsuited Eucharistic ministers beneath the spaceship ceiling. Spaceship ceiling. I saw it in Rome, dude. Maybe it wasn't wrong. I think it was. It was actually at it was in.

Speaker 1: 49:20

It's at the Holy House of Loretto is where it is. Yeah, it's at the Holy House of Loretto. There is a spaceship mosaic that has sputnik. It's just so bad. It was started in the 50s but, like, completed in the 70s after the council, and it's just so bad. Carlson, to his credit, pushed hard on suffering, evil and the hatred of christ in the modern world. He wanted to know why christians are the most persecuted group on the planet. Farron responded with a powerful insight. The 20th century was pivoted into what it's such a powerful insight.

Speaker 1: 49:57

Yeah, the 20th century was really bad then pivoted into how his little league coach once told him to get on your knees and smell the infield. Somehow this was supposed to illuminate the mystical structure of reality. Look, here's what. Here's what I'll get.

Speaker 1: 50:13

I tried listening to the the baron tucker interview like I did. I really tried to give it a go. It just was kind of boring. Like it just it was just kind of boring. It was it.

Speaker 1: 50:25

I heard a lot of the things from Baron that I've heard before. I was like I wanted him to deliver, like Catholicism, to Tucker Carlson, because Tucker is in a very seeking moment. Like he keeps bringing people on to talk to them about god and he's looking for someone to just come out and like say something. So like, look, you can't think baron is going to be bishop williamson. Like he's just not. You know right where I think tucker would love to hear from bishop williamson. God rest his soul, you know. But it's just don whoa bar Baron, talk like Baron. How disappointing he's. Just a post conciliar guy man he just is. Mel Gibson did better on JRE than Baron on Tucker 100% yes and no, like yes and no, um, like okay. So what I think um mel did really well on on. Jerry was the shroud conversation, but you can't talk to a normie right how it did yeah about set of accountants no, I agree with that like you.

Speaker 1: 51:53

Just you can't do it. You know, like you. You, because they're just going wait, what, what? There was smoke, it was black smoke. It was wait, there was white smoke and there was black. So wait, like you're trying to give the siri thesis to Jerry. He has no idea about any of this stuff. Well, that's the point, right?

Speaker 1: 52:10

So Baron is kind of beige and that's like I don't think he's a bad guy, like I don't, I don't think he's one of the guys that is like oh, we have to get Baron out. Like I, I didn't like when everybody just kind of pushed Baron out, like he was, look, he said some pretty terrible things. He was on the bench appear and he was like well, jesus is the privileged way. Like like come on, you can't do that. Like you can't do that, you just can't Like.

Speaker 1: 52:40

There was actually an interesting like a juxtaposition to that conversation when taylor spoke with um, what's his name? The the black rapper? Uh, the crazy, crazy freaking. Uh, all the black rappers are crazy man, no, god, bryson gray yeah, I know you talked. Uh, taylor spoke with bryson gray and bryson just asked questions about catholicism and taylor was just like no, there's no salvation outside the church, like he just was like blatant about it. He didn't. Yeah, yes, yes, you like there was something refreshing about that conversation that taylor had, because it's like oh, this is what it looks like when somebody presents Catholicism and doesn't hold back and doesn't pretend we're because there's a tendency and I do it too.

Speaker 1: 53:34

That's why I'm not so harsh on Barron, because in my personal life, when I'm speaking to non-Catholics, I don't just come out and tell them you're going to hell because you're not Catholic. You're going to hell because you're not Catholic. Like there's ways to nuance the conversation where you're presenting Catholicism as something beautiful and fulfilling, without necessarily knocking them. Like the way I go about evangelism is very rarely talking about, very rarely talking about Jesus and it's not not to say that I don't ever, but it's rare. Like what I try to do is get to I understand, especially when you're in the moment on a podcast and you're you know there are millions of people watching. Like I would imagine it's kind of a lot of pressure to so much you get to say Michael prayer.

Speaker 1: 54:40

Well, listen, I can't even knock them for that, because I was on with John Henry Weston two weeks ago and I almost forgot the second half of the hail mary just because I was put on the spot. It's like.

Speaker 1: 54:52

I don't like. Sometimes, when you're put on the spot, you're just like oh, it happens, you know. So, like I, I can see messing up the saint michael prayer, especially the second half, gets a little tedious there, come on, it's like you're put on the spot in front of a live audience. I I could see maybe missing a a you know a phrase or two in there. Uh, the difference is that if someone asked you if they would go to hell for not being catholic, you would tell them yes, I don't think baron would.

Speaker 2: 55:20

Yeah, I I, baron, lost a lot of trust with that.

Speaker 1: 55:26

That uh shapiro interview yeah, yeah, the shapiro interview and the and the dare we hope stuff. Yeah, it's like you can't present dare we hope in one sentence and then in the next, talk about how well the church stopped emphasizing on hell and that is what led to all this stuff. Like like there's either a a big calling that comes with being catholic or there's not. It's and I'll tell you what the. The main reason so many you do see a lot of orthodox converts right now is because the orthodox church is it's a majority men, not just in the hierarchy. Like I understand, we have a all-male hierarchy, but at the parish level it's mostly women running the parishes. It's mostly women passing on the faith to their children. Like we're starting to reverse that. We are especially like our audience right. Like we're talking to a lot, a lot more young men trying to put the call on men to be the priest in your home and make sure you're the one Someone should tell that.

Speaker 1: 56:32

To Turning Point, You're not wrong, like right, like the whole young women leadership conference that they're doing and things like that, like there's something very masculine in the presentation of orthodoxy that are that is attracting young men. And when you attract young men, those young men then go and convert people and they bring their women with them. But if you have women doing the evangelization in the catholic end, you're going to get a very feminized version of the faith brought to people which I mean yeah.

Speaker 2: 57:11

So like growing up and having to go through all the um, the net, ministry focus, life, teens type stuff. It was all teenage girls, yeah, and it made it just miserable and terrible and so gay well, we even should.

Speaker 1: 57:27

We like, okay, so we'll. We've passed around the videos of, like the rock concert, catholic things, right, and I'm like, would you even want to be at this? I'll ask that. And that usually is a very big viral thing that goes around and it's like, yeah, you'll get a lot of men that say, well, it's not mass. You know, like, well, it's not mass. It's like, okay, it's also not catholic, like this, this, just, it's just not catholic and it's even if people do get something beneficial from it, right, like so they had the eucharistic congress.

Speaker 1: 58:00

That happened, right, baron baron, like one of my biggest criticisms of him was his homily at that Congress, because he goes if every one of you left here and we're on fire for the faith, you could like the, you could like the world on fire and you could pass that faith on. And it was like he was saying that under a time when we were being told we aren't allowed to live our faith boldly, like we're not allowed to go and live live our faith, and like we can't allowed to live our faith boldly. Like we're not allowed to go and live live our faith, and like we can't, we can't worship god reverently. We were. We were in the midst of tradition at the time. We were dealing with like all this craziness and baron is telling people go out and do this, this, this and this, and it's like, well, we're being told we're not allowed from the vatican.

Speaker 1: 58:43

No, so it was kind of strange. But the rock concert's like okay, there's a lot of women out there singing and doing their praise and worship thing and I know there's a lot of very good people in the charismatic movement and they get a lot out of that stuff. But I don't know if you could say that it's good like overall, like there's something to just saying look, look, we have to cut our losses with a lot of these things and just get back to what grew the church early on and that was just men living out the faith and men going out and preaching the gospel I mean the charismatic movement coming directly from like, like communist communes and in crazy protestant like heretics, like.

Speaker 2: 59:30

No, there's no way it can be a good thing overall. God has used it to bring some you know, some people into the church and many charismatics do eventually find tradition. But no, in the end it's still a like a, a crazy heretical movement but?

Speaker 1: 59:44

but also what is because I, what is the proper role for women who do want to evangelize? Like there are a lot of women who fall in love with the church and fall in love with Jesus Christ and they want to go out and evangelize because it's something that happens to you when your heart gets lit on fire for the faith, right? So I don't even know if I know the answer to that. Like I don't know, I don't know if I know the proper answer for that.

Speaker 2: 1:00:14

Like young women that act like they have a ministry needs to become religious sisters and go teach in schools and orphanages that's what they did for for centuries, yeah I think how many, how many kids were, were, you know, without parents, were raised in the church by nuns I'm kind of okay with this too yeah, I agree you know like women go into women's conferences and other women.

Speaker 1: 1:00:40

You know helping each other and I know there's a lot of messiness of those things. Yeah, the women's conferences usually end up terrible um, this is a controversial thing too, because I know that's what tim gordon said right, mary. But I mean, you get into the apparitions of our lady and like she's the greatest evangelist in the history of humanity but she, I mean she juan diego was a man and it's not.

Speaker 1: 1:01:18

I don't think you, I, I have a hard time with saying mary didn't evangelize, like I know she didn't teach, like she didn't go out and evangelize when she was alive. She wasn't going out teaching.

Speaker 3: 1:01:28

But the apparitions of Our Lady have led to more conversions.

Speaker 1: 1:01:32

You want your wife to listen? No, absolutely not. I don't want my daughters either. No, I don't. I would never send my daughters to that young women leadership conference ever, under any scenario like it, just wouldn't.

Speaker 1: 1:01:50

Yeah I I mean, yeah, like that, the nuns were the catechists for a long time, weren't they? Like I don't look, I'm I, I don't want to, I don't know, I don't know the I don't. We're in a different world than we were for centuries when women were doing this thing. Like we're just in a different world than we were for centuries when women were doing this thing. Like we're just in a different world now. So I don't know, with technology, the way things are going, I don't know what the correct answer is. I just know we need a much more masculine approach to everything and I think the reason young men are attracted to the Latin mass is because there's not women running all over the sanctuary. Everything is very like.

Speaker 1: 1:02:31

We got into this with Keith Nessler and he said it transcends gender. And there's no, I don't agree with that. It's. There is something very masculine about the Latin mass and I think that women are attracted to that, like women want to be led by men, you know. So it's, it's, I think. I think it's allowing women, because I think most of the women not like leave the liberal church, like parishes aside, most of those women who are extraordinary ministers and things like that, like they're doing it out of a desire to want to serve. They're not doing it because they're um. They're not doing it because they want to change things and become women priests like that's just not the majority of it. The majority of your novus ordo parishes is just women who love their faith and they're like oh, how can I help?

Speaker 2: 1:03:24

and they want to help and the priests encourage it. I don't know, growing up, a lot of the women that were involved were they're the ones that ruled their homes. Yeah, they were very. Their behavior was very disordered and transgendered in a sense and they really did seem like they wanted authority. They were going to take it if it wasn't given to them. I I think that that I'm not gonna say that's everyone, but that was growing up. That was a lot of the women that were involved in the local parish yeah, I think that's.

Speaker 1: 1:04:01

I think that might just be brain rot from feminism. Like I don't know if they're consciously doing it for that. Like I don't, I don't know, they're just, they're just boss chicks because they grew up in the rot of feminism and they don't even know they're doing it. A lot of women are like that, like they're just I mean, you see it all the time like there's nothing worse than the conservative feminist which every is a complete contradiction in terms.

Speaker 1: 1:04:30

It's a complete contradiction in terms, and it's every woman speaker at that. Bring up that woman's speaker list. Do you have it anywhere I can find it yeah, find that woman's speaker list. Just look at every single woman on there, like they're.

Speaker 2: 1:04:41

They're the women I have the hardest time with I almost tweeted that when I saw that thing I'm like, oh look, it's every single woman anthony has no respect for I. They're the most obnoxious, annoying the only one that wasn't on there it was was, uh, lauren bobert don't worry, give him time, they'll add her.

Speaker 1: 1:05:00

I've never liked learning anything about the faith from women. Um rob's changing anthony quick. No listen, this is who said that I'm the misogynist in the group here.

Speaker 4: 1:05:19

I'm trying to play good cop tonight some of those things we were tweeting today oh, I can see you're gonna be bad cop tonight.

Speaker 2: 1:05:30

I'm like, isn't that what you want? He goes absolutely oh, I got.

Speaker 1: 1:05:34

I should really play the voicemail. I think you might have cursed in one of them, so I can't, but I should.

Speaker 2: 1:05:39

Oh, there's a lot of cursing in those messages this morning.

Speaker 1: 1:05:44

If I can zoom in rob was. Rob was furious this morning. So, uh, telsey gabbard yeah, I don't know who a lot of them are, erica charlie kurtz wife alina haba, lila rose well, alina haba is trump's lawyer, who is just looks like she is like an only fan. She's running around in a bikini. Brett cooper oh my gosh. Lila rose, dana lash, riley gains, riley gains. The legit man, ali stucky, might be the most obnoxious, annoying woman on the planet. No, no, nancy mace nancy mace is on there.

Speaker 1: 1:06:30

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to give her. I have to take the title from you. Nala ray, how are the? How is this a real conference? How is this a real?

Speaker 2: 1:06:41

conference?

Speaker 1: 1:06:42

I don't think I know anybody else, I don't know any of these broads. Yeah, I don't know any of those broads, but it's just no. I wish we had somebody we could trust as a spy to go in there and listen to some of the feminist insanity that they're going to spew yeah, we don't do we the only Molly, the only group she is more misogynistic than we are that's why she watches our show.

Speaker 1: 1:07:22

We're trying to find this clip. Oh right, here we're trying to find this clip. So if anybody can find that clip for us, we want to see it. Okay, I should go there as a speaker okay, okay, we do it.

Speaker 2: 1:07:41

Someone did send it.

Speaker 1: 1:07:41

All right, let's watch the clip I got because I didn't make. I made it an hour into the baron interview so it's literally. You were about a minute away oh, it's at one hour and 45 seconds yeah, I was like I'm just under an hour into it and I just started watching outdoor boys. I'm like I can't.

Speaker 2: 1:08:02

I really did get you into that, I am obsessed with the outdoor boys. Like obsessed with the outdoor boys but the only Mormon I've ever been able to stand.

Speaker 1: 1:08:12

He is the man dude Like he is. He's so like. I wish I had a dad that took me to do the things he takes his kids to do, like it is. If you guys never seen the outdoor boys like, I just came upon him because I saw he put the video out that he's not doing videos anymore and I just went back and I love survival stuff like I, my favorite show ever is their, their mormon paul yeah, he's more, but he doesn't he doesn't know, he doesn't come into the show at all, at all in any way whatsoever other than on their, their family trips every sun or sunday.

Speaker 2: 1:08:44

They do show them like they turn off the cameras, like we're going to church now.

Speaker 1: 1:08:48

That but that's it yeah yeah, it's just I honestly I love the the winter survival stuff like I love watching him get through like a negative 20 night with no tent and he's just like I'm gonna freaking survive for a night in negative 20, but anyway, all right, let's do the baron clip okay, let me get who's? Jerry metadix. I know eric metadix, oh, that's metaxis. I don't know who jerry Metadix, oh that's.

Speaker 5: 1:09:21

Metaxas. I don't know who Jerry Metadix is. I couldn't agree more. I've come to this conclusion recently but I think you're exactly right by a wicked mind that wanted to undermine the church. But then now look at the whole 20th century and the level of destruction and degradation. It's hard for me to imagine it's just because of political forces or cultural forces.

Speaker 4: 1:09:44

I couldn't agree more. I've come to this conclusion recently, but I think you're exactly right. So what's the St Michael's prayer that was?

Speaker 5: 1:09:51

St Michael the archangel, defend us in battle. I won't get it exactly right, but it's an invocation of Stael to defend us in battle against the devil who sends his minions for the destruction of souls.

Speaker 2: 1:10:01

so it's a very conscious awareness of the presence of evil in the world I guess that's look, I get being on the spot, but he should have known way more than that the thing is that's not as bad as people seem to make it out to be well like I said, I like I've been on shows where like, especially like the, the hail mary and latin, like if you're saying the ave maria and it's like like you're just put on the spot in the moment, yeah, like, so like it's like growing up right in in in the church, uh, and like in our fatima cadet stuff, every year we did a living rosary where every you know, every kid is one bead and you go through the kids saying they each say whatever their prayer is and, like I, prayed the rosary daily. Growing up, like you know, I had every single, you know standard Catholic prayer memorized by like the age of eight yeah, to this day, put on the spot, like to say the Hail Mary, you'll forget it.

Speaker 1: 1:11:08

Yeah, yeah, it's like my brain just gone. Yeah, it's Santa Maria, Mater Dei.

Speaker 2: 1:11:23

Ora Pernobis Peccatoribus, nunc et in hora mort, stop it. I know it, I'm just telling you when you put on the spot, what about the?

Speaker 1: 1:11:26

first half. Oh, stop it, I said, when the second half comes to you. That's why, at least in the second half, no, it was bad, you're right it's pretty bad.

Speaker 1: 1:11:38

But the thing is it's bad to us because we go to the, the latin mass, so I hear the saint michael prayer every sunday, like it's it's embedded in us, where bishop baron doesn't say the saint michael prayer, not regularly. If he's saying the rosary daily, he should be. He's not, though he said he's never had like he prays the daily office like I don't think he prays the rosary daily. He prays the daily office like he's a priest, priest or priest or priests have to pray the daily office yeah they have to.

Speaker 1: 1:12:13

So like really the the rosary is the ladies daily office, essentially Right. So it's like a priest isn't going to pray it the way we pray it. But um, and I skipped the St Michael's prayer a lot when I do the rosary too, like when I pray the rosary, I don't, I don't know we say the St Michael's prayer, I don't, I, I'll get through.

Speaker 2: 1:12:36

Once I get through that last decade, I'll you say that, you say the hail, holy queen right hail, holy queen.

Speaker 1: 1:12:43

And um yeah, but that's usually. I'll usually end it like if I'm especially if I'm doing it on my way into work. It's like we don't add the saint michael prayer to our rosary. Is that a thing?

Speaker 2: 1:12:54

it's not so many guys. Rosaries are normally, they're part of the rosary, but I've never in any public rosary I've ever been and I've never heard it not said yeah but like I said, when I like, when I pray my rosary daily, I don't always say the same michael prayer don shut your mouth

Speaker 4: 1:13:15

he's right, rob's a modernist and he was a michael friend of the rosary everybody called you out rob I knew it was coming too it's very common but it's not part of the rosary.

Speaker 1: 1:13:33

Was that interview in?

Speaker 2: 1:13:34

charlotte, he may have been respecting local customs but that's so.

Speaker 1: 1:13:37

That's what I was just about to say. Like the, the charlotte bishop actually was going to ban the saying of the saint michael prayer. So like there are some nova sordo parishes that are very traditional and they say the saint michael prayer at the end of mass. There are a lot of. There are a lot of traditional parishes they say the rosary right. So like you'll say the rosary before mass and then you'll say the St Michael pair at the end of mass is a lot of good traditional Nova Sordo parishes that will do that. And he was trying to ban that. They're trying to ban kneeling for communion. He was trying to like crazy things this guy was going to do.

Speaker 2: 1:14:19

I did not see anything with the Charlotte SSBX I don't know what this is referring to.

Speaker 1: 1:14:23

No, me neither. Yeah, supers did ban it. Yes, baron does believe in the devil, all right. So the other thing I wanted to just go over was Kale's tweet. So Kale just said I'm two-thirds through Bishop Barron's combo with Tucker. It's wonderful. It's a teacher being asked by a curious man about why he believes what he believes and how he believes. It is witness in its purest form. If it triggers you, log off and go in a quiet room for 10 minutes because you've let ideology pollute your seeing and hearing.

Speaker 1: 1:15:03

Baron understands the assignment. He is reaching an audience of millions through tucker, while first talking to the man himself. So I see that point of view also. Um, and, like I said, it's one of those things where I do appreciate Baron going in and having these conversations in these places that aren't typically having them. So I do like that he went and spoke with Jordan Peterson. I do like that he had Shia LaBeouf on. I do like that he had the conversation with Tucker.

Speaker 1: 1:15:43

But Cale, yes, yes, I mean Cale, you're a bit of a boomer man. He's a bit of a boomer guy. He's like look, I got to have friends of all ages guys. I just you know it's all right. Um, I, baron is like the okay, especially for a guy like kale. I'll explain this to you guys. So, um, for those of you who are recent converts or converted in the last 10 years, you, it's the same thing, uh, the same kind of hero the jp2 was and benedict was, baron was in that mix.

Speaker 1: 1:16:23

Baron was very much the like in that lighthouse catholic media world. He was, uh, I know, cal's not a boomer, he's gen x, don's a boomer. So, bishop Barron when he came out with that Catholicism series, he was very much seen as like a super Orthodox priest, like he was. He was Father Barron back then. He wasn't Bishop Barron back then and he was just seen as a very orthodox priest trying to present the faith he was. He was seen on on the same level as, like, uh, father mike schmitz and scott han. He was very much in the mix with all those guys. So for these guys, like they'll, oh, like baron will always hold a special place for them. Like, yeah, but you have to, all right.

Speaker 1: 1:17:21

So, current celebrity Normie Catholic, like that was your catechesis for years in the late 90s, like the 90s and 2000s, you got your catechesis through Scott Hahn, jeff Cavins freaking. What, uh, fricking, what's his name? Who's the guy with the cowboy hat? Not Jeff, not Jeff, not Jimmy Eakin. The other guy, steven, uh, steve Ray. Like you got your catechesis from these guys.

Speaker 1: 1:17:49

These were the. These were the Protestant converts who came in. They were convinced of the Catholic faith and they actually explained the Catholic faith better than any of your cradle Catholics were at the time. Like they were still so caught up in the council stuff and like you had these Protestants come in and they actually talked about, like what made Catholicism unique, where most of the Catholic hierarchy were talking're, talking about how, how we're just like everybody else.

Speaker 1: 1:18:20

So you know, baron is a cradle Catholic, obviously, but he was very much in the mix with all of those lighthouse Catholic media guys. So I think he'll always hold a special place to a lot of people like, and he was one of the first ones to get out on the YouTube world and actually go and confront these new atheist types and things like that. So I understand people's attachment to him. I understand people's affinity for him. I just think we're in a different era than we were back in the 90s and 2000s and I think that young men are looking for something a little more bold at the moment. So that's our Baron Tucker take, we're going to go over to the other side now and we're going to talk about some some other stuff. I do have quite a few stories that could lead to very good discussions. Let me just see Was there anything else we were supposed to cover?

Speaker 1: 1:19:21

No we'll do it on the other side either way. So all right, guys, if you are not Locals members, please join us over there. Subscribe to our Locals. It's very cheap. It's the best way to support our show. Whoa, we got 1,200 people in here. How many people are? We got 550 on YouTube. You guys better all hit, like and share this show. It's about time you guys made us the biggest Catholic channel. Come on, stop it. If you're not going to subscribe on locals, at least share the show. It helps tell people about us.

Speaker 2: 1:19:50

They all came from, yeah, otherwise, you're all just stuck with all the biz. Larpers that on YouTube.

Speaker 1: 1:19:55

I'll tell you, man, the biz larpers that on youtube. I'll tell you man, I find it difficult to listen to um a lot of things these days. Like I've really just decided I'm watching outdoor boys, like I really I'm just like I'm kind of done listening to a lot of like I I don't know, I I like doing this, I like, I like what we talk about.

Speaker 2: 1:20:17

But yeah, I don't watch uh other path of content at all I do, I still, I still do, but it's getting rare.

Speaker 1: 1:20:26

So I think what we're gonna do. I want to ask hitchborn to come back on because, uh, before I left I was on um joe mclean show with him and I. We were talking about some stuff over there and I was like you'll be my first guest when I get back from greece, we'll have you on. So rob and I did our show tonight. I think we're gonna get hitchborn on thursday if he's available. And then we got to figure out when we're bringing nick back on, because everybody seems to be missing nick. And, yes, we have to get theo on, but that's going to be a scheduling issue because he's in.

Speaker 1: 1:20:53

He's in the uk theo from from the two cities podcast yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure so, uh, we're gonna have to figure that one out. I'll have to reach out. It might have to be a saturday show yeah um, so we'll figure that out. All right, guys, come over to locals, we'll see you on the other side. Take us out, rob or just kill the feed.

Speaker 2: 1:21:13

Yeah, I'm going to kill the feed.

Speaker 1: 1:21:28

What did Bobby just send me? Oh, I can't even watch that. That's horrific. Why would you send me that, bobby? All right we're good.

Speaker 2: 1:21:39

Someone says Catholic Christian deserves to be invited on, after you slandered him on twitter. Yeah, no, we didn't. We didn't. We didn't go after the guy hard enough. Who, uh, the he's the guy the um no, the. Everyone was arguing with him when the charlotte news dropped. He's the. That was while I was away.

Speaker 1: 1:22:08

I was away for that what what happened with him?

Speaker 2: 1:22:11

you're the one who retweeted him.

Speaker 1: 1:22:16

Let me see if I can find the tweet that no one likes what's funny is like um, steve and uh rick were saying like everybody outside of charlotte should just shut up. You guys don't know what's going on and everybody's like rick. So rick was complaining that life site was getting a petition together and petitions are cringe like they definitely are. But I do think we're in a different time than we were under francis. Like I do think under francis, when you complained on podcast, francis would double down just to be like, oh yeah, screw you where I? I don't think it's going to be that way with leo. Like I really do think leo wants to bring some kind of peace to the church. So I think the complaining actually got some things done and it clearly did, you know. So it's like the, the uh steve was like, oh, I don't want. You know I'm not trying to make fun of steve like he didn't want podcasters going off on their typical tangents because he thought it would just make it worse.

Speaker 2: 1:23:22

He went on three or four podcasts to give interviews. I think it was more. He just didn't want people to talk about it without him.

Speaker 1: 1:23:30

I'm serious, yeah, because he's in the know and it's his diocese. People are weird about their stuff. They are. Did you find the tweet?

Speaker 2: 1:23:42

I'm going at that. I've been more active on twitter than I should have been over the last couple weeks I can yawn on this side, won't catch any pressure.

Speaker 1: 1:23:55

Oh, let me. While you're doing that, I'm going to log into locals, okay, Does anyone in the chat have the tweet? I want to tell you guys what happened in Greece, though.

Speaker 2: 1:24:11

Lots of things happened in Greece, I'm sure.

Speaker 1: 1:24:14

Yeah, but like some crazy.

Speaker 2: 1:24:18

Okay, so at real, ericccabe is the guy. Let me see the tweet. Oh yeah, the oh. So he said the fact that everyone is freaking out about tlm restrictions is exactly why we need them. Detached from liturgical obsession and ideology, is the stay-at-home dad I retweeted that.

Speaker 1: 1:24:41

I don't remember reading that no, well, that's his tweet. I don't know what you said about it I actually I was away during this whole fiasco and I had to tap out because I was like I I have to be present, but like I can't, I can't, I couldn't be caught up in liturgy wars in america while I was away you turned your phone off and we all thought you were legitimately dead yeah, I had to.

Speaker 1: 1:25:10

Just, I was just like this is not because I would have gotten sucked right in, and I was. I found myself getting angry like I felt like I did when traditionist came out and I was like this isn't even. Like I felt like I did when traditionist came out and I was like this isn't even my diocese, I'm away with my family.

Speaker 2: 1:25:22

Let me, let me, let me just get out of this yeah, so I don't see that you retweeted that, so I don't know what that guy's talking about um, don's telling me what happens in Greece, stays in Greece.

Speaker 1: 1:25:35

but so first say the funny story about your daughter drinking. Wait, which story? Which one?

Speaker 2: 1:25:54

The one where you said she started drinking more or less like for the first time and started asking the cute bartender how to. Oh, and you're like.

Speaker 1: 1:26:09

I need to put her in a convent. Yeah, holy cow. So, like my daughter doesn't drink, you know, so I bring her down, so we're staying in this beautiful villa and but if you walk down the cliff, there's like a walkway down the cliff and there's this beautiful like resort at the bottom of it and there's a bar there and I bring my daughter down to the bar and I get her a pina colada and she drinks it and there's like three, uh, 20 something bartenders there and she's like um, she finishes her pina colada and she's like how do you say thank you in greek? And he's like at party, so whatever the hell word he tells her and she goes how do you say thank you, handsome, I go get your ass, don't you dare?

Speaker 2: 1:27:00

you should have asked the greek guy. Do they have a comment?

Speaker 1: 1:27:02

I'm on athos because I'm about yes, I got a nice masculine drink he gets her the masculine drinks we had.

Speaker 1: 1:27:16

so, okay, so we're there. We went. It was my in-laws took us on the trip. Um, it was my family, my wife's two sisters and their families. Now, my in-laws paid for the villa and they took us out to three very nice dinners, but the rest of it was kind of on us and my, my sister-in-law, was like very upset because she's like they're they're offering to take us on vacation, but like they're not really taking us on vacation. You know, it's like like it caused it caused us a lot of money to go.

Speaker 1: 1:27:53

So there was just this, like this tension about money the whole time and then, like, when you're managing 16 personalities, people won't get along, you know, and every single time this was going on, it was like me and my family were in the middle, because me and my family were just there having the best time, like we just like I get along with every single person in her family. My wife is the last person that would ever cause trouble but there was just this tension on the other two sides and it was like me and my wife were just caught in the middle of the whole freaking time. So they all had little kids also. So there was just like like one or two nights where I was just like, all right, nicole, let's just go out and take Nikki and Sophia out. And we went out like bar hopping with our 18 and 19 year old.

Speaker 1: 1:28:42

It was actually like really fun. We just got to hang out with our kids and it was. It was interesting to like like you go through different phases when you're raising kids and like I loved to have, I loved having little kids around so much, but now that my kids are adults, essentially it's so interesting to like sit and have a conversation over a cocktail with them and like get them to start talking to you about like real things. You know, the thing is I have stories I want to tell but I'm like man, I don't want to get in trouble. I can't want to get in trouble.

Speaker 2: 1:29:20

I can't I mean which stories, Cause you've told a lot of the stories.

Speaker 1: 1:29:28

I know I have, but man did we have way less subscribers? Wait a minute.

Speaker 2: 1:29:35

Are we telling people they shouldn't have subscribed? If less people had subscribed to locals, they'd get better stories. Okay, that's going to do have subscribed. If less people had subscribed to locals they'd get better stories. Okay, that's that's gonna do the opposite of get people to come to locals okay, so oh man yeah, just change the names, right, if it's not that, it's not that like I don't care about I don't care about telling the people and locals.

Speaker 1: 1:29:58

I worry that a family member will watch this. I don't care.

Speaker 2: 1:30:04

Wait, hold on. Let me actually make this for supporters only at this point.

Speaker 1: 1:30:08

Oh dude, I'll kill you. Are you kidding me? Okay?

Speaker 2: 1:30:13

It does a minute-long countdown, so don't say anything for a minute that you don't want people to hear it looks gay with that hair.

Speaker 1: 1:30:23

This is the haircut I've always had. What are you talking about?

Speaker 2: 1:30:27

I think that's grover, I'm sure he always.

Speaker 1: 1:30:32

He always finds his way in um. Yeah, I'm not worried about you guys at all. Like what do you? You guys don't know my family, who cares um?

Speaker 2: 1:30:44

yeah, if he had been dead in greece I I didn't have his wife's number to even text text her, yeah, but like, all right.

Speaker 1: 1:30:51

So, dude, I all right. So I've told the story on air about my sister-in-law getting left a lot of money, yes, by my wife's grandfather, right. So when that happened, that actually is like a very big part of my conversion and because, like, I saw like real envy and hatred in myself and it was like like I had to like come to terms with that and and really learn to be happy for people, no matter what good happens to them. So, like it, like I saw such an ugliness in me because when, when that happened, like I really wished bad upon them.

Speaker 1: 1:31:41

I wasn't just like I was mad that my wife wasn't left the money, I was like I hope they burn through every fricking dollar of that and they have fricking like I wanted the worst for them and like living with that in me led to me like calling out to God for help, because I was like this is, this is evil Like I. It was evil, legit evil, but living through that experience helped me like learn perspective for every everybody in my life. Like it. It made me that like, when good things happen to people, like I'm always happy for them because, like, when, when, when, good things happen to other people, if it in any way negatively affects you, it only affects you.

Speaker 1: 1:32:27

Like having hatred for somebody, having envy towards something like it does not affect anybody but you you think you're hurting the person by by having that feeling, but you don't, you actually just destroy your own soul. But because I went through that experience like my, my wife's other sister married a multimillionaire Like when I say multimillionaire this guy is, forget how wealthy and they have everything and it helped me, like so the one sister got left money and the other sister married a wealthy guy and me and my wife were kind of just like you know, I'm a construction worker and live very normal life. But what it did was it helped me and my wife not just me like my wife was able to have very similar experience to me where, like, she then was able to be happy for her one sister and then, when the other sister was very fortunate too, it was the same thing. It was like you know what, like just be happy for them, like why would you ever not be happy for somebody but the, the sister?

Speaker 1: 1:33:31

that he married into jersey shore the sister that was left, the money did actually go through, all the money. Yeah, okay, like I mean it's, it's, it was 17 years ago. Like they did actually go through all the money and her they don't make what I make, even close. Like. So even even going on this trip was very hard for them. Like I get paid time off so I was able to at least like I didn't miss a paycheck going, like with the we we had to pay for half the airfare, so it was like, uh, right off the bat, before we even won, it was like 2500 a family. Then, uh, they had to get passports renewed. It was another thousand. Then he loses a week's pay, like he was in for five grand before he even stepped foot on the island.

Speaker 1: 1:34:19

So then when we go there, they're like, like you know, this is like they wanted to go on an all-inclusive, so like they didn't have to really pay for it, right, but because we all knew they were in that situation, like the, the other sister was like offering to pay for stuff and that causes its own problems. They took it as like an insult, right. So like it was like anything anybody wanted to do was a problem with this one, and then this one was offended because they wouldn't accept it and it was just dude. It was just like I was just in the middle like I, I want to. I just want to go hang out. Guys, can we just like? Can we just go into town and like go have fun?

Speaker 1: 1:35:04

And it got to the point where, like the last day, um, my son just said to me he was like like we thought we were all gonna just like hang out together and have like a really fun last day and everybody was just kind of like bummed out on the last day, my son goes, dad, goes, dad, let's just go do something. Like we're in Greece, when the hell are we going to do something Like? I want to go see some stuff. So we wound up going to Delos and Delos was a fricking really cool place.

Speaker 1: 1:35:29

It was this island that it's the mythical birthplace of Apollo and you go there and it's like dude, this was at one point in time it was all like the priests and priestesses of the ancient Greek religions would have like orgies on the island and things like that. And then it became a Roman outpost and a trading post. So you see, all of these I actually let me see if I can find the tweet so you can bring it up, cause I posted a thread on it so you can actually see some of the pictures.

Speaker 2: 1:36:15

Yeah, I have it.

Speaker 1: 1:36:16

You got it. Yeah, just just look up delos on my uh, so okay. So you go there and like there's, there's these platforms and altars and things like that, where, like they would literally like do their ancient greek religion. So the whole island is like this. But you also see like how everything's in ruins like that. Those used to be lions. They look like seals now, but just from weather and all that stuff, they they don't look like lions anymore. But I'm looking at it and I'm like why are they all in ruins like this? Though, like I don't understand, was there like a violent thing that happened here? So, like me and my son went on this like quest to like find out what happened, and we're like reading every single one of the plaques and stuff. So it turns out there was, there was the. It was devastated and looted twice, once by Mithridates the sixth and Pontus.

Speaker 2: 1:37:09

Yeah, whatever.

Speaker 1: 1:37:12

Mithridates the sixth and Pontus in 88 BC and again by pirates in 69 BC. These attacks and subsequent changes in trade routes led to the islands decline and eventual abandonment. But then in the middle ages they found a monastery there. Like there were Christians took it over, there was a Christian art all over the place also. But I'm like, why are the buildings in ruins? Because these things were built to last thousands of years and you could see the remnants of what's there are still very much intact.

Speaker 1: 1:37:45

But what happened was, after a certain point in time, people just started looting the island for building materials and instead of having to go to a rock quarry and actually quarry the rocks and cut them and stuff rock quarry and like, actually quarry the rocks and cut them and stuff they would just go and steal the blocks from me, uh, from delos, and bring them to the neighboring islands and build things with those blocks.

Speaker 1: 1:38:04

So like, everywhere you went on, this island looked like a world war ii, not even on delos, on mykonos. Like it looked like a world war ii fort, just all done in stone, and like it was just such an unreal place, man I I never seen anything like it. Like, everywhere you see is just this white plaster but then all these beautiful stonework everywhere. It was just very cool, but it felt like when we left there, it was like like there was just so much tension and what it made me realize is that that original gift that the one sister got was really a curse, like because they never got to go through the same like in in when it first happened I thought it was like I, I thought it was a curse on my wife, almost I was like why would he do this to my wife?

Speaker 1: 1:39:04

It's not like he had a special relationship with my sister. It was a really weird thing that happened, but I see God's hand in it in hindsight, where it was just like there was such a blessing in disguise in that moment, but she never got to experience that. So, like everything to her has been just this comparison ever since and I like my heart hurts for her and that's why she's she's the one that I think I have a very good chance of like bringing to god, because I I do see like a lot of the hurt that's there. You know, it's like the, the I, I. I see she's experiencing what I experienced at one time, you know, and it's like I'm hoping I can like maybe reach her because I feel like like she, she's got an openness to it, because she knows something's off with the way she's feeling. You know, she knows it's not, she knows there's something off with it, because I had that very exact same experience. So it's like it's it's something that I uh bring her to the novice order. Look, sometimes like these crazy things that happen are the thing that God uses to bring us to him, you know. So it's like it does it?

Speaker 1: 1:40:23

Whatever happened happened? It's not you know. It's just I'm hoping that, like, whatever it is she's experiencing is making her look deeper at, like, the meaning of things. You and it's like like none of the material crap ever makes anybody happy. It's, it's. It's it might make things a little bit easier, but it doesn't actually fulfill you in any way. It it's just material stuff and it's. You know, some of the most, some of the most troubled people have the most material possessions. It's just the way it goes. Have you tried reading her the gospel in Hawaiian Pigeon? What's been going on with you? While I was away, You've been pretty quiet. What do you mean? You checked out the group chats a little bit. Were you just hanging out, hoping the kids?

Speaker 2: 1:41:25

Oh, just really, really busy, yeah, just busy. The kids are in T-Ball now, so that's every Monday night and Wednesday night ball now, and so that's every monday night, a wednesday night, um, going to mass, you know, and on sundays is a is a whole day event and then stuff like that.

Speaker 1: 1:41:51

So yeah, uh, rob, and I fought wars on twitter. Yeah, rob, and I fought wars on twitter, yeah what do you think's going on with russia and ukraine? Yeah, in regard to, like, the recent the recent events, like what is going on there I, I don't know, I, I, what.

Speaker 2: 1:42:17

What ukraine did was absolutely insane that's right.

Speaker 2: 1:42:21

Like I, don't think people understand the insanity of what ukraine did, uh, those so. So, for those of you don't know, ukraine used, um, they basically smuggled in drones, shut up Siri. Ukraine used semis to smuggle drones into Russia. They drove these semis to within a couple miles of some of Russia's strategic air and naval bases. And these are bases thousands of miles away from Ukraine, where the weapons involved are in no way involved in the war on Ukraine, becauseica, more or less in the event of a nuclear war, and so, like I said, these weapons are in no way involved in the war in ukraine and they, the bombers specifically, were, all you know, lined up outside on a runway very easy to hit. And the reason for that is it's due to treaty regulations between the US and Russia, that's called the START treaties, where we can verify each other's nuclear arsenals and nuclear readiness and basically verify that we're doing what we agree to in these treaties. So parts of their nuclear arsenal are always visible to our satellite so we can see and verify, and part of our nuclear arsenal is always out in the open available to their satellite so they can see and verify, right? So Ukraine uses this opportunity to wipe out um part of their nuclear arsenal.

Speaker 2: 1:44:21

Uh, the bombers that can actually deliver these weapons, um, and the number, number of destroyed is ukraine is saying one thing, russia's saying the other, of course, um, but like, even, even if it's so, russia's saying like five, ukraine's saying like 40, and Russia's only got like 60 to 80 of these types of bombers. And these are bombers that were built during the Cold War and Russia doesn't build any more of them, you know, and even getting parts for these things are near impossible. And it's the same way in the US. That's why our strategic nuclear bombers, most of them, are B-52s made up in the 1950s. We're not building more of them. We hardly have the parts for them, like the fact we plan on using them up until like 2050. These things are going to be 100 years old before we get rid of them. So Russia is the same way. So, even if Russia only lost five of them, that's insane. That's insane.

Speaker 2: 1:45:29

And Russia and the US both take strikes on these strategic nuclear capabilities to be more or less nuclear strikes, like, no, they didn't use nukes, someone's ability to use nukes. That throws the whole mutually assured destruction calculation into a tailspin to where, suddenly, like, if they're doing that is that because they plan on launching a first strike? And if they're going to launch a first strike, does that mean you need to launch a first strike right now to stop it Like. This is the stuff that literally would have started the apocalypse in the eighties, yeah, and the fact that Ukraine's playing around with this and they're saying they did it all by themselves no intelligence, no support from the West. If that's the case, that's insane and if anything, we should be the ones taking out Zelensky, like we should bomb that guy.

Speaker 1: 1:46:09

At that point. Yeah, Because he's going to start World War freaking 3.

Speaker 2: 1:46:15

You know, so we should be the ones to shut it down.

Speaker 1: 1:46:20

It three, you know, so we should be the ones to shut it down.

Speaker 2: 1:46:23

It's just absurd to think we didn't know they were gonna do it. If we did know and we like, if we did know and we allowed it, then trump is 10 times worse than biden dude.

Speaker 1: 1:46:32

I just think I've been watching this Russia-Ukraine nonsense play out for 20 years. It's the same thing with Israel and Gaza. There's no stopping it. It's a train set in motion. I don't care who the president is. This is way past presidency levels. This is like CIA-level stuff that they've been working towards. They've been working on it for 20 years. They're not going to abandon their plan out of nowhere, like I think there's going to be.

Speaker 1: 1:47:08

I thought it was going to be that they were going to get some peace treaties signed and then somebody they were going to use a false flag to say Russia broke the peace treaty, or something like that. But this is just pure insanity. Like they did nothing to the battlefield. It's not like Ukraine gained any momentum on the battlefield here at all. They bombed places that have nothing to do with the war itself. They're still in the same exact position as they were on the battlefield, except now they pissed Russia off really bad. So I don't, I don't know, man. This is, this is getting into for you younger guys, man, you guys in your 20s, you guys should all be freaking furious about this, because what it really means is, if they wanted to drag us in, they're going to need a false flag on American soil too, like there's no way the American people are going to go for going to war with russia without a pearl harbor incident yeah, like like I, I am, of course, as a catholic, I'm completely against the use of nuclear weapons.

Speaker 2: 1:48:12

But if, um, if putin were to use, uh, what they call a tactical nuclear weapon in this scenario to strike Ukraine, no one should be surprised. This has literally been a Russian doctrine forever. They've warned everyone. You know what the US doctrine is? The same. Someone takes out one of our nuclear missile submarines on purpose.

Speaker 1: 1:48:36

You, you started a nuclear war you're essentially starting a nuclear war. It's crazy, no man, they're gonna take uh over to the delhi's. Uh, yeah, I just. I just move on to theology.

Speaker 2: 1:48:57

Do you think the recent kind of attacks by so-called Palestinian supporters in the US are actually what they say they are?

Speaker 3: 1:49:09

Such as the murder of the two Jews and then the so-called Egyptian guy.

Speaker 1: 1:49:14

I think the narrative coming out of it is crazy, like saying, oh one was a Holocaust survivor. Like shut up what there's a holocaust survivor in there, come on. That's ridiculous, but no, I do think israel has done enough to infuriate people that people would be willing to do with that guy yeah, yeah, like it's not, that's not that's not. I don't need that to be a false flag thing. That's like what you know, especially somebody from egypt watching. You know the guy's egyptian, like that doesn't sound so crazy to me oh I don't.

Speaker 1: 1:49:46

I'm not crazy about pope leo's initiatives with israel. It's like I'm just tired of this post-World War II narrative. I'm just pretty sick of it.

Speaker 2: 1:49:59

I mean, you know, we weren't Catholic from Chicago. He was never, not going to be for Israel. You know what I mean.

Speaker 1: 1:50:08

He's literally my dad's age, born the same year as my dad, and I tried to have that conversation with my dad and it's impossible.

Speaker 2: 1:50:17

I'm planning on cutting off a finger to dodge the draft my son's 19 dude.

Speaker 1: 1:50:24

I'm very worried yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:50:29

I'm also like I really am concerned that there's going to be some kind of a false flag thing you know, for everyone who said that russia and putin are like the bloodthirsty aggressor in this whole situation, the fact that it's been what two or three days now and in russia hasn't actually yet responded. Yeah, there was a lot of actual um I can't.

Speaker 1: 1:50:55

Putin's gonna catch hell from his own people if he doesn't do anything like there's a lot of factions in russia that wants him to just unleash hell most of them.

Speaker 2: 1:51:08

Uh, you know, in the west we hear how he's like this authoritarian dictator tyrant, that that the people are all against.

Speaker 2: 1:51:17

And there's these protests in moscow and st petersburg and so on, and everyone hates them. It is all nonsense. It would be like, you know, showing a crowd of 100 people in san francisco protesting well anything and saying, oh, all of america is against this. No, sorry, the russian people as a whole rather love putin and always have, because he's, he's like the authoritarian father figure that, like the russian people like inherently need and desire, um and he they, they think he loves them and they think he works for them and does what's best for them. And if, if you think about it, it's the same reason why so many mega people like Trump.

Speaker 1: 1:51:59

Yeah, Do you think this is actually a good point, like, do you think ADHD medication would disqualify kids from getting drafted?

Speaker 2: 1:52:12

I don't know. I don't know the full regulations on what does and doesn't. I know asthma disqualifies you because that's why I got not into west point, but um, I don't know that'll be, that'll be interesting to say.

Speaker 1: 1:52:32

Everybody running out to go get on riddling and breaking historically.

Speaker 2: 1:52:37

Like the military gives their soldiers meth right. Don't you want a bunch of kids on Adderall?

Speaker 1: 1:52:47

Whacked out of their freaking mind. Oh man Hang on, we got something else we could cover before we cut out. Oh, what was the setting up that chat all about?

Speaker 2: 1:53:07

I didn't I think I said about uh, just there, x slash. Twitter is coming out with a new, different, integrated chat program. Instead of just dms. It's going to be like encrypted. I don't. I don't know, I haven't tried it yet um, okay, and then wait.

Speaker 1: 1:53:31

Did you see the trump ai video I saw you tweet, but I didn't watch it.

Speaker 2: 1:53:36

Oh, dude you gotta watch that.

Speaker 1: 1:53:37

Hang on on. We're going to play that. That's what we got to play.

Speaker 2: 1:53:41

Okay, let me find it.

Speaker 1: 1:53:55

Here, I got it, I'll send it.

Speaker 2: 1:53:58

Well, when did you tweet it? It has to be I got it. I send it. Well, when did you tweet it? It has to be I got it.

Speaker 1: 1:54:01

I sent it to the DM. You gotta watch this video.

Speaker 2: 1:54:04

This is nuts why are my DMs coming up?

Speaker 3: 1:54:22

Don's going to bed.

Speaker 1: 1:54:23

Yeah, we're wrapping it up in a minute, don. We're just going to play this Trump clip because this AI is wild, like how accurate they have AI down to now that this kind of leads in with the Russia conversation.

Speaker 3: 1:54:39

To me they're the absolute worst group of people we've got in our country and it's not even close. I think we'd all be better off with them gone. But, as I was saying, my administration and I have been taking careful note of the work of Colossa Labs, the biotech company that resurrected the dire wolf. If they can bring back wolves, they can bring back dinosaurs. Terrible lizard, that's what dinosaur means if you break it down. But picture this folks. Velociraptor mounted border patrol agents, they'll rip your head clear off. Pterodactyls patrolling the skies, velociraptors on the ground to prevent the immigration apocalypse we may have to counter with a dino apocalypse. Folks, it's true, they're the absolute worst group of people we've gotten how realistic is that?

Speaker 1: 1:55:28

yeah? It's pretty dude it looked at first. It sounds just like it doesn't have that. Ai feel to it, like that looks legit if you and the funniest part is like if that really was trump, like you wouldn't doubt it. Like it sounds like some crazy crap he would say like he's out of his mind and it's like I'm just, I cannot. I don't know what happens in a year or two when just fake imagery is being thrown at us. It's going to be nuts how realistic it is and how accurate it all is.

Speaker 2: 1:56:07

Yeah, I think there's going to be. I don't know. We've got to come up with a way to verify you have verified. We got to come up with a way to verify you have, like verified. And of course, the problem is, once you start coming up with ways to have verified, like communications, that's a good way for government to control things. You know what?

Speaker 1: 1:56:28

I mean Digital ID, and in that bill that Trump passed, part of it was that states can't.

Speaker 2: 1:56:34

Well, the bill hasn't passed. The bill hasn't passed.

Speaker 1: 1:56:37

The House passed it.

Speaker 2: 1:56:38

The House passed it the house passed it.

Speaker 1: 1:56:39

The house passed, all right, still gotta go through. The senate did it go through senate. Yet did they? Did they shoot it down? It hasn't gone through yet not yet um, but in that bill it talks about uh states not being able to regulate ai for 10 years, federal government having complete control over regulation on it and it sucks because I really want that bill to pass because it deregulates oppressors, does it? Yeah, it also. No tax on tips and overtime yeah it's like huge for me.

Speaker 1: 1:57:08

Plus, I don't know how super chats work with tips, like I don't know. I don't know.

Speaker 2: 1:57:15

To me, this whole, this whole gig is tips like I think the irs probably says otherwise yeah, but this whole gig is tips.

Speaker 1: 1:57:24

Come on, um, palantir is going to have all the date, all my data and send the drone after me to explode my head due to antisemitism. That's. I do worry about that stuff, man. Yeah, like the things we talk about, like even the texts we send, everything like they're like him giving palantir that kind of control over our data. I mean they were doing it anyway, like that was the whole snowden leaks and everything like they're doing it anyway. But, like man, they are at an advanced stage in ai where they're going to be able to tell everything yeah, I don't know, man, it's.

Speaker 2: 1:58:02

Uh, it really does make you wonder. Like is it? Is it? Would it be worth a full reset? You know what I mean?

Speaker 1: 1:58:11

like I just think this is like the ai stuff. I think is going to lead to digital ID, because you're going to have to have verification, you're going to need to know that who's saying something is actually saying it and you're going to need that digital verification ID. But, like I don't know, I think it's all leading to that. It's just leading to another. I see another COVID-like something. It may not be a virus this time, it could be something else, but it's just going to be another covid like freaking disaster that we're all dealing with worldwide and I don't think it's that far off.

Speaker 1: 1:58:51

I don't know. I don't know how they don't let this crap get away from them, like if it's not just the american government doing it, it it's other countries doing it. Like how do we know Russia doesn't retaliate with some kind of freaking cyber attack on us? Did?

Speaker 2: 1:59:06

you hear about what the Chinese did.

Speaker 1: 1:59:09

Tried to do no.

Speaker 2: 1:59:11

They caught a couple members of the Chinese Communist Party trying to sneak some sort of super mold into some sort of agricultural facility in michigan. Like they said, like if, like it could have knocked out large sections of all. Like american agriculture dude I didn't read much about like the details, but about like the details. But, um man, we got some unique, uh, unique, new members in here huh I, I'm almost positive, joe rogan fan is grover you think?

Speaker 1: 1:59:52

so it has to be. Just has to be. Just trying to stir shit. Yeah, I don't know, man Stuff's getting crazy, but this is our first show back Takes an episode to get back into the groove. I don't know. I think we're going to have to do a Pope Alexander. The Sixth episode soon.

Speaker 2: 2:00:21

I have the same book you have I to read it.

Speaker 1: 2:00:23

It's short, it's quick get through it in a sitting, yeah yeah, we'll have to do. I mean, look, I don't want to do any more pope shows and uh, you know I really wanted to like leave liturgy alone until the whole Charlotte stuff popped off. Well, there might be good news coming with it. So there was decent news tonight. So let's see how things pan out.

Speaker 2: 2:00:46

Majorian, do you know much about Alexander VI? Because if you do, we should have you on for it.

Speaker 1: 2:00:51

I want to have Majorian on anyway.

Speaker 2: 2:00:53

I agree.

Speaker 1: 2:00:55

Yeah, I want Majorian on. So should we have majorian on next episode or or after hitchborn? Should we do majorian first and then hitchborn? Or because if majorian comes on, we're not like interviewing him. He's just going to sit in on an episode and we're going to do an episode and he's just going to be third mike yeah like we'll let him sit in his third mike yeah, let's just let's do that.

Speaker 1: 2:01:18

that for Thursday, if he's available All right, majority, and if you're around Thursday we'll have you on and you'll just sit in as a as third mic. Yeah, don't worry, you're just going to. We'll do cultural commentary and we'll get your take. We'll get, we'll get a, we'll get a zoom take on things. And yes, majoran, we know yultism, that's what we want.

Speaker 2: 2:01:43

Yeah, I can't wait for him to spaz out and throw nietzsche into every other word and okay, no, nietzsche allowed. That is gonna be the rule.

Speaker 1: 2:01:48

We don't need a joe boca tell us how, how nietzsche converted him. And look at him, I don't know. We'll do a woman. We'll just. We'll just do a woman about e-girls. We'll do an episode about e-girls, something like that. But all right, we're going to wrap this one up, guys. It's been fun. I'm glad to be home and I'm looking forward to getting back in the groove of the show. It was. It's hard when you go two weeks without doing it and then jump back on. If you guys can share it, share it with people, tell everybody how great it is, and we'll see you guys on Thursday.

Speaker 2: 2:02:18

Buy wine.

Speaker 1: 2:02:20

Yeah, buy wine. We'll see you guys Thursday. Thank you.